Squad for Poland game announced (1 Viewer)

[Unicron]

And the faux pas of picking a player for the squad and then changing his mind before the tournament was really thick, and unlikely to engender a fun buzz.

Didn't Jack do the same?

 

[Hector Grey]

Didn't Jack do the same?

Did he?
He probably introduced whiskey into the conversation, thus softening the blow.

 

[Richie]

I feel like Trap is almost trying to goad the FAI into sacking him at this stage.. Picking a fight with Stephen Kelly, apparently the world's most level headed, ego free and agreeable footballer, just seems weird. Think he wants to get his payoff, get back to sunny Milan and not have to worry about watching Hull or Derby and coming to a pissy raining rock where the journos constantly get on his back about Stephen Ireland / Andy Reid / James McCarthy / Wes Hoolahan / etc and the locals aren't grateful to him for masterminding the glorious Euros qualification. Either this is another in a long string of stupid misunderstandings, or one of them is actually lying, in which case you'd tend to side with Kelly given Trap's history of gaffes and badly judged comments.

 

[Jerry Twig]

The current crop who actually get their game couldn't give two fucks either way

That's not true at all. Grossly unfair.

 

[washingcattle]

That's not true at all. Grossly unfair.

Okay that's probably not fair. I'll rephrase it this way, they are the most limited bunch of players I've ever seen and even at 100% they are still only average but know that that's all that's asked of them and that thy won't lose their place in the starting 11. So they don't try any more than that.

It wasn't fair to say they don't care but they sure as fuck don't want to go out and play actual football.

You can't say that anyone actually wanted the ball against Kazakhstan. They passed us of the pitch. That's not good enough.

 

[Jerry Twig]

Jaysus, don't even remember posting that.
I think giving 100% is enough, but yeah you're right about not wanting the ball

 

[Unicron]

Did he?
He probably introduced whiskey into the conversation, thus softening the blow.

Gary Waddock yeah?

 

[Hector Grey]

Gary Waddock yeah?

I thought Waddock was crocked. Maybe i'm thinking about John Byrne. Anyway, noone is saying that Jack wasn't a grade a cunt who wasn't afraid of ostracising players, or no tplaying actual footballers, that's been well documented. but he was into teh game, he went out there and he watched players and he exploited the granny rule to its maximum potential and he was forever trying to improve the calibre of player we had. Also, he got results. And to play that kind of game, which, 25 years later, Trap apparently wants to play, you need certain tools. Jack had em. Trap does not. I'm talking Cas, ALdo, Quinner. And of course, some actual defenders.

Jack's team had many failings, but they were better players and i think the football was more exciting, but i know that's just rose tinted sepia vision. It was out first foray into tournament football. The Romania game is probably unwatcably bad, but i remember it as being edge of the seat stuff. So really, we can't make comparisons. And there's the whole English game changing dramatically in that time. When we beat England in Stuttgart, we had a team that had 3 lads who'd just played in the greatest Liverpool team of the 80s. I remember thinking at the time how full of it they were, saying we didn't have the same calibre of players as the English. Everyone one of those lads played in the top half of division 1 (or Celtic). They were no mugs. Now our only Champions League player is Adien McGeady. There's no Irish lad at Mans U or City, chelsea, arse, tottenham... Everton is as good as it gets these days.

I dunno, i think if "smaller" nations like Azerbaijan or Kazakhstan or Belarus can pass it around and try and play football, we can too, right. I mean, sure those teams might get beaten, but lets face, we're getting beaten. The reason Spain, Italy, Croatia and Germany fucking annihilated us is due to the tactics. You can't chase the ball around the park against these lads. Trap refuses to let them play football cos a nil all is better than nothing. And his favouritsm is ridiculous. How does St LEdger get to be a starter when he's not getting a club game. Also, he's no interest in watching our players, it's obvious. He really does look like he doesn't give a fuck any more, as if having to put up with guff from fans and the press and people saying he should watch Norwich is well beneath him. He's paid a fucking fortune. I mean, relative to the size of the nation, he must be the best paid international manager in the world. For that, he should be scouring the Championship for players to groom.

I dunno, i just feel no connection to the team any more. I really couldn't care if we qualified for the world cup or not.

 

[Cormcolash]

McGeady isn't our only Champions League player!
We also have Anthony Stokes.

 

[washingcattle]

I thought Waddock was crocked. Maybe i'm thinking about John Byrne. Anyway, noone is saying that Jack wasn't a grade a cunt who wasn't afraid of ostracising players, or no tplaying actual footballers, that's been well documented. but he was into teh game, he went out there and he watched players and he exploited the granny rule to its maximum potential and he was forever trying to improve the calibre of player we had. Also, he got results. And to play that kind of game, which, 25 years later, Trap apparently wants to play, you need certain tools. Jack had em. Trap does not. I'm talking Cas, ALdo, Quinner. And of course, some actual defenders.

Jack's team had many failings, but they were better players and i think the football was more exciting, but i know that's just rose tinted sepia vision. It was out first foray into tournament football. The Romania game is probably unwatcably bad, but i remember it as being edge of the seat stuff. So really, we can't make comparisons. And there's the whole English game changing dramatically in that time. When we beat England in Stuttgart, we had a team that had 3 lads who'd just played in the greatest Liverpool team of the 80s. I remember thinking at the time how full of it they were, saying we didn't have the same calibre of players as the English. Everyone one of those lads played in the top half of division 1 (or Celtic). They were no mugs. Now our only Champions League player is Adien McGeady. There's no Irish lad at Mans U or City, chelsea, arse, tottenham... Everton is as good as it gets these days.

I dunno, i think if "smaller" nations like Azerbaijan or Kazakhstan or Belarus can pass it around and try and play football, we can too, right. I mean, sure those teams might get beaten, but lets face, we're getting beaten. The reason Spain, Italy, Croatia and Germany fucking annihilated us is due to the tactics. You can't chase the ball around the park against these lads. Trap refuses to let them play football cos a nil all is better than nothing. And his favouritsm is ridiculous. How does St LEdger get to be a starter when he's not getting a club game. Also, he's no interest in watching our players, it's obvious. He really does look like he doesn't give a fuck any more, as if having to put up with guff from fans and the press and people saying he should watch Norwich is well beneath him. He's paid a fucking fortune. I mean, relative to the size of the nation, he must be the best paid international manager in the world. For that, he should be scouring the Championship for players to groom.

I dunno, i just feel no connection to the team any more. I really couldn't care if we qualified for the world cup or not.

Absolutely agree with you. I'd rather lose playing the right way than win playing the ay we do now. If we're losing now then fuck it lets at least lay down a marker etc.... and set an example... and lose properly. If I was 9 years old and watching the national team now I wouldn't give football a second thought, on the other hand if I saw what that Zebra lad (or whatever his name is) doing that back-heely thing in bum rape ball (or whatever its called) I'd be signing up for D4 ball (or whatever it's called) like a complete dick. Where's our fucking back-heels huh ? Glenn fucking Whelan ? Fuck this I'm too pissed and having watched Phil Neville and Johnny H knock us out of europe I'm sick of football.*



*Not really just sick of losing

 

[Hector Grey]

Absolutely agree with you. I'd rather lose playing the right way than win playing the ay we do now. If we're losing now then fuck it lets at least lay down a marker etc.... and set an example... and lose properly. If I was 9 years old and watching the national team now I wouldn't give football a second thought, on the other hand if I saw what that Zebra lad (or whatever his name is) doing that back-heely thing in bum rape ball (or whatever its called) I'd be signing up for D4 ball (or whatever it's called) like a complete dick. Where's our fucking back-heels huh ? Glenn fucking Whelan ? Fuck this I'm too pissed and having watched Phil Neville and Johnny H knock us out of europe I'm sick of football.*



*Not really just sick of losing

I don't mind the scrappy victory on the car park in some outpost of the former former CCCP. But all our "victories" are scrappy, but we've added losing SPECTACULARLY to our box of tricks. It's true, i would have rathered loing to spain, italy, germany etc if we actually went at them, played against them, learned something from it. But nothing has changed. What happened on that magical night in Paris? Who was in charge of that team?

 

[washingcattle]

I don't mind the scrappy victory on the car park in some outpost of the former former CCCP. But all our "victories" are scrappy, but we've added losing SPECTACULARLY to our box of tricks. It's true, i would have rathered loing to spain, italy, germany etc if we actually went at them, played against them, learned something from it. But nothing has changed. What happened on that magical night in Paris? Who was in charge of that team?

Robbie Keane, Richie Dunne, Shay Given, Damien Duff and Kevin Kilbane probably.

 

[CinnamonBoy]

Robbie Keane, Richie Dunne, Shay Given, Damien Duff and Kevin Kilbane probably.

True that. I don't think those reports of a player revolt and choosing the tactics were false. (And by tactics, we actually just, quite literally "put 'em under pressure" and got stuck into them)

I could do a rant but it would probably become incoherent so I'll just make some brief observations (just to get them off my chest)

Jack's football wasn't actually that bad. It was exciting. We'd punt it up but with green shirts swarming around, winning back possession and crossing and scoring goals, it was good to watch. I wouldn't mind the WC games. They're a different kettle of fish. Jack also was loved by the media and the players. The buzz around the team was terrific. And he had a team of MEN. Razor, Aldo, Cas, Quinny, Moran, O'Leary....they actually don't seem much older now except for in appearance. The lads today....they're just not the same. A good bunch of lads for the most part but not the same calibre of male we had back then.

To Trap. His tactics are all wrong. He thinks we can't play so it's better to defend and then try to win 1-0. We got lucky in the last campaign. We won't have that luck this time. The players at his disposal I would argue would be better to attack than defend. We play teams like Armenia or Macedonia and they have one playmaker who makes a mockery of us but is let down by the fact his team-mates are shit. Well we can field a team of Premiership players and one of the best playmakers in the division in Wes Hoolahan (this isn't a flavour of the month thing, I'd have had him in a couple of years ago). Yet we don't do that. I'd love to watch Hungary with Zoltan Gera at the heart of things. They're on a serious revival now. And his team-mates wouldn't be anyway as good as Pilks, McGeady, McCarthy, Walters, Long.....

Trap needs to go. Even his dismissal of Ian Harte. I don't like Harte a whole heap, thought he was fairly rubbish, but ex-players deserve some sort of respect. Harte gave a lot to the team. Even Alex Pearce, he played the friendlies, did well, starts for Reading at the weekend......nowhere to be seen last week. And CB is a problem position at the moment. Trap is a senile prick. Not celebrating Hoolahan's goal with Tardelli. And this is the Irish national team manager? Disgusting.

Reasons for optimism would be lads like Noe Baba. That lad at Spurs who seems to be Bale MK II. James McCarthy turning into a man (he still looks 17). Pilks (an absolute peach of a fella, by all accounts), all those young lads off the U-15s and U-16s who are having success. (Word is that all the underage teams play serious passing football. A lad on the You Boys in Green forum said his team that he coaches played St. Kevin's and it was like playing Barcelona. )Tommie Hoban at Watford, Sean Murray, McClean copping on a bit (I think he's great), the Derby lads......

This current team won't be going to Rio anyhow.

 

[washingcattle]

Reasons for optimism would be lads like Noe Baba. That lad at Spurs who seems to be Bale MK II. James McCarthy turning into a man (he still looks 17). Pilks (an absolute peach of a fella, by all accounts), all those young lads off the U-15s and U-16s who are having success. (Word is that all the underage teams play serious passing football. A lad on the You Boys in Green forum said his team that he coaches played St. Kevin's and it was like playing Barcelona. )

The only way kids are going to play serious passing football in Ireland is if

A. every club invests shitloads in it's pitches and

B. We move to playing the season between April and September (If we haven't already....Have we ?) when the pitches aren't a fucking bog. When most of us old bastards played ball it was under fucking water most of the time and by the time it got warm (remember when summers where warm ?) it was like playing on a car park made of grit. You could only pass it as down the sidelines where there was still 5 blades of grass. Then we all wonder why kids are just hoofing it away and we produce more centre halves than creative midfielders.

Every year we played all summer and the matches in pre season and up until hallowe'en were great craic, then you'd have a burnt out car and a puddle you could drown in in the centre circle.

It's about changing the footballing culture Bill.



Jesus I am one cranky old bastard

 

[CinnamonBoy]

The only way kids are going to play serious passing football in Ireland is if

A. every club invests shitloads in it's pitches and

B. We move to playing the season between April and September (If we haven't already....Have we ?) when the pitches aren't a fucking bog. When most of us old bastards played ball it was under fucking water most of the time and by the time it got warm (remember when summers where warm ?) it was like playing on a car park made of grit. You could only pass it as down the sidelines where there was still 5 blades of grass. Then we all wonder why kids are just hoofing it away and we produce more centre halves than creative midfielders.

Every year we played all summer and the matches in pre season and up until hallowe'en were great craic, then you'd have a burnt out car and a puddle you could drown in in the centre circle.

It's about changing the footballing culture Bill.



Jesus I am one cranky old bastard

No kids under the age of 13 should be playing 11-a-side on a full pitch. Simple as that. I attended the St. Joseph's Boys "Saturday Morning Programme" when I was a nipper. I learnt how to play there. Skills, 5-a-sides. After 11 or 12 though you move on to full size pitches, heavy balls in the rain on a shitty pitch. It does no promising footballer any good. Not that I was much use, mind.

But I think things are ok now. Obviously there's the St. Kevin's example I gave, the make up of the underage teams has a great smattering of teams represented. Paul Doolin seems to be doing good things with the Under-19s. I'd advocate kids not going to big clubs to rot slowly in the youths and then reserves (Clifford). I think we'll be good. I'm always optimistic, we always produce decent players. We just need a progressive manager to bring that out. Trap is the furthest thing from it possible.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepag...Bale-lookalike-at-Tottenham-Kenny-McEvoy.html

 

[washingcattle]

No kids under the age of 13 should be playing 11-a-side on a full pitch. Simple as that. I attended the St. Joseph's Boys "Saturday Morning Programme" when I was a nipper. I learnt how to play there. Skills, 5-a-sides. After 11 or 12 though you move on to full size pitches, heavy balls in the rain on a shitty pitch. It does no promising footballer any good. Not that I was much use, mind.

But I think things are ok now. Obviously there's the St. Kevin's example I gave, the make up of the underage teams has a great smattering of teams represented. Paul Doolin seems to be doing good things with the Under-19s. I'd advocate kids not going to big clubs to rot slowly in the youths and then reserves (Clifford). I think we'll be good. I'm always optimistic, we always produce decent players. We just need a progressive manager to bring that out. Trap is the furthest thing from it possible.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepag...Bale-lookalike-at-Tottenham-Kenny-McEvoy.html

5 a side fair enough but on grass, that's vital. Astro turf is ruining football because kids are afraid to tackle. We trained on a hockey pitch at one stage it was a fucking disaster. Legal action nearly insued after one kid lost a few layers of skin (and I mean a fair few). But fuck him it's part of the game and he should have known better than trying to nutmeg..... eh ..... a certain bull headed centre half.

And that's why I hate 5 a side. What shall I have a go at next ?

 

[Cormcolash]

New astro turf is grand, the artificial grass ones. That Hockey Pitch shit should be banned though, for sure, fucking awful surface.

 

[washingcattle]

New astro turf is grand, the artificial grass ones.

Don't like it, the ball just doesn't behave properly. I can't explain it any better than that, anyway I was a centre half, any game where you can't shepherd the ball out for goal kick is tough for me to handle.

 

[Hector Grey]

Don't like it, the ball just doesn't behave properly. I can't explain it any better than that, anyway I was a centre half, any game where you can't shepherd the ball out for goal kick is tough for me to handle.

Corm's right, astro is okay now, it doesn't burn like it used to, but the stuff they use at the top level is a hybrid any way. Premier league teams don't play on "grass" as such.

Mind you, it's been blamed for a few injuries itself, as the ground is much firmer than it used to be and players studs can sometimes get caught causing knees to twist and what have you. It seems to happen a lot, but then, we all watch way more footy than we used to so who can tell?

Also, the success of Long, Doyle, ahem...Connor sammon, should prove to the young flets that they can start their careers here and get picked up by an english team if they're uselful. How many of the last squad started in the Eircom (or whatever it's called now?). Wesley H for a start. Lads don't have to move to scunthorpe when they're 15 any more.

 

[washingcattle]

Corm's right, astro is okay now, it doesn't burn like it used to, but the stuff they use at the top level is a hybrid any way. Premier league teams don't play on "grass" as such.

Mind you, it's been blamed for a few injuries itself, as the ground is much firmer than it used to be and players studs can sometimes get caught causing knees to twist and what have you. It seems to happen a lot, but then, we all watch way more footy than we used to so who can tell?

Also, the success of Long, Doyle, ahem...Connor sammon, should prove to the young flets that they can start their careers here and get picked up by an english team if they're uselful. How many of the last squad started in the Eircom (or whatever it's called now?). Wesley H for a start. Lads don't have to move to scunthorpe when they're 15 any more.

Where is this astro grass so I can give it a go some time ?

The quality of the LOI is a lot higher than it was 10 years ago alright. The only problem there is that there are players in it now that probably should have moved on a few years ago and could have made it a bit further but didn't and now probably won't. Ronan Finn at Rovers is a good example he was at Coventry City but they were going nowhere so he left to finish school and move to UCD. Most of The Sligo Midfield would slot into a Championship or League 1 side fairly easily.