economic meltdown (4 Viewers)

[Buzzo]

Do you know what's actually happening? The emergency homeless shelters in town are filling up with Eastern European people who aren't getting any more work from the construction industry*. The nightbus... the bus that goes around and collects people who have nowhere to sleep to put them in any spare beds in the hostels are apparently turning away 30-40 people a night. The HSE pulled funding from the homeless services! The first people to feel the biggest pinch, as always, are the poorest.

* only those who are eligible to access homeless services

 

[Wobbler]

I was thinking about this yesterday and wondering how exposed I am to it all. I've no mortgage/loans of any kind. No investments/shares/savings/pension. Have a 3 year contract at work. Am I ok? Is there something i'm forgetting? The only thing I can see getting badly stung on is diesel, which I don't use a lot of anyway.

Well you're unlikely to suffer much but you could find yourself with much less disposable income.

 

[flashback]

ehhhhh. Hmm.
Ok, so you are saying that pensions are going to be hit.
Some are. Some partly. Some not really. (I think.)

Homeless people?
I dont think this is going to have much of an impact on the homeless.
I mean, I just feel that we are all fucking scrubbing about on the periphery, desperately fretting about Bear Stearn's getting their comeuppance from them acting the wanker for years, shitting ourselves that there might not be as many scraps thrown from their table.

No matter what, its fucked. If they are doing well, they act the cunt screwing everyone they can, citing "let the market decide" every time they shaft someone, and then as soon as their maggotry catches up with them they are off to UAE, and the Fed cap in hand, crying and pleading and threatening all manner of terrible things.

I dunno. I know fuck all about economics. But I know the sort of rich merciless cunts that work in that sort of business. They are all for playing hard ball when they're not on the rack. But heaven forfend they get it in the neck, yis are ALL gonna suffer.

 

[Wobbler]

The first people to feel the biggest pinch, as always, are the poorest.

Alot of people appear to miss that point.

 

[classic seanc]

Look, are we having a communist revolution or not?
C'mon lads ffs

 

[Wobbler]

ehhhhh. Hmm.
Ok, so you are saying that pensions are going to be hit.
Some are. Some partly. Some not really. (I think.)

Homeless people?
I dont think this is going to have much of an impact on the homeless.
I mean, I just feel that we are all fucking scrubbing about on the periphery, desperately fretting about Bear Stearn's getting their comeuppance from them acting the wanker for years, shitting ourselves that there might not be as many scraps thrown from their table.

No matter what, its fucked. If they are doing well, they act the cunt screwing everyone they can, citing "let the market decide" every time they shaft someone, and then as soon as their maggotry catches up with them they are off to UAE, and the Fed cap in hand, crying and pleading and threatening all manner of terrible things.

I dunno. I know fuck all about economics. But I know the sort of rich merciless cunts that work in that sort of business. They are all for playing hard ball when they're not on the rack. But heaven forfend they get it in the neck, yis are ALL gonna suffer.

Nobody is defending the traders but an economic meltdown will affect the poor more than the rich.

 

[Buzzo]

Homeless people?
I dont think this is going to have much of an impact on the homeless.

Are you joking?

 

[Hector Grey]

Are you joking?

really. you're homeless. how much worse can it get? somebody robs the street?

 

[Moods For Mallards]

There will be some great 'bad times' songs. Watch out for slews of new Ghost Towns and Eton Rifles. If we're lucky, Ireland itself might produce a post-Tiger slump Cactus World News.

 

[flashback]

Are you joking?

No, not really.
Ok, so the corollary of what you are saying is that when the stock market booms, as it was doing for the previous few years, there is a surge in funding of homeless outreach projects.

I dont see that happening. I see no trickle down from great days on Wall St into the shelters, into getting dudes fed and warmed up. I see much the same piss poor shit as always.

The only time I see that is when the govt decides to do somehting about it, Giuliani and now the Bush Admin has been absolutely cutting that back continuously, regardless of the economy.

Like I said though, I am more than happy to be told shut the fuck up, that I'm wrong. Maybe I just dont understand.

 

[cephalopod]

what I wanna know is how will this all affect joe soap, the man on the street, mr. average, him, how will it affect the ordinary fella? with the mortgage and the 2.4 kiddies? that's what i wanna know

 

[flashback]

what I wanna know is how will this all affect joe soap, the man on the street, mr. average, him, how will it affect the ordinary fella? with the mortgage and the 2.4 kiddies? that's what i wanna know

Are we talking about Pete here?

 

[broken arm]

Like I said though, I am more than happy to be told shut the fuck up, that I'm wrong. Maybe I just dont understand.

Well, there are probably two perspective on the problem

the first being there is a potential problem in that you have to take one less holiday a year because a few million were wiped off your stock.

OR

It is a problem because the publicly funded services that keep you close to something similar to dignity, away from starvation and possible death are withdrawn/restricted because some people somewhere are too greedy.

 

[Hector Grey]

where does all this money go? you know, these billions that were lost?

 

[cephalopod]

where does all this money go? you know, these billions that were lost?

they never existed

 

[broken arm]

where does all this money go? you know, these billions that were lost?

generally, it is billions of pounds worth of promises, expectations and trust.

 

[Buzzo]

Flashdude:

I don't really have any great understanding of economics but what I'm saying, and what I witness, is that when there is a downturn in the economy, or when the government have to make any kind of cut in funding, the first people to be affected are those least likely to make a noise or effect the political status quo, such as homeless people, drug users, immigrant people etc.

I completely agree, the funding and support for services to marginalised people are inadequate and policies are short-sighted and driven more by a 'shut the fuck up' ethos than a 'let's make society fairer' ethos, even when the economy is thriving. It's not like for the last ten years homeless people have been doing well or anything, but what happens is that funding is cut, while inflation continues to inflate (or whatever...). Let me be specific here.

The number of homeless people increases, inflation increases while the funding remains stagnant. Do you really think this doesn't effect the services that homeless people can access? Does my point about the fact that there are 30-40 more people a night being told they have to stay on the street not point to the downturn in the economy having an effect on homeless people?

- There is a drinkers shelter in town. It is unhealthy, dangerous and pretty deflating place to be. There are two new shelters built and ready to open up to accommodate the people who live in the drinkers shelter but the HSE have not allocated funding for staff and so at least one of those shelters that would offer support to entrenched and aging drinkers will not be opened.
-There is a day centre in town that is badly needed for active drug users built and ready to open... because funding by the HSE has been pulled, they do
not have the staff to open this vital service.
- There is a hostel in town where grown men (with huge stress levels, substance problems and all the attendant physical, mental and emotional difficulties that go with being homeless) have to share dorms with 15 other men. The service was ready to be temporarily closed to rearrange the building so that those who have to stay there would have some dignity in the form of smaller, cleaner spaces. This plan is halted because funding has been pulled.

I could go on dude....many staff are not getting increments or increases and morale is lowering in the services in general. This is only the beginning of this shit. I, for one, am moving under the sea before my heart *actually* breaks.

 

[Wobbler]

No, not really.
Ok, so the corollary of what you are saying is that when the stock market booms, as it was doing for the previous few years, there is a surge in funding of homeless outreach projects.

I dont see that happening. I see no trickle down from great days on Wall St into the shelters, into getting dudes fed and warmed up. I see much the same piss poor shit as always.

The only time I see that is when the govt decides to do somehting about it, Giuliani and now the Bush Admin has been absolutely cutting that back continuously, regardless of the economy.

Like I said though, I am more than happy to be told shut the fuck up, that I'm wrong. Maybe I just dont understand.

Well for these things to exist, funding is necessary. For them to be run efficiently, funding needs to increase every year. If tax revenues decrease (which they will) the government won't have as much funds available for these projects so either less people will be able to get help or the quality of help available will decrease.

Meanwhile as living expenses increase, social welfare payments decrease (or don't increase in line with inflation) fewer people will be able to pay their rent which will mean more homeless people which will mean that any projects will be further over stretched.

 

[Wobbler]

Well for these things to exist, funding is necessary. For them to be run efficiently, funding needs to increase every year. If tax revenues decrease (which they will) the government won't have as much funds available for these projects so either less people will be able to get help or the quality of help available will decrease.

Meanwhile as living expenses increase, social welfare payments decrease (or don't increase in line with inflation) fewer people will be able to pay their rent which will mean more homeless people which will mean that any projects will be further over stretched.

Flashdude:

I don't really have any great understanding of economics but what I'm saying, and what I witness, is that when there is a downturn in the economy, or when the government have to make any kind of cut in funding, the first people to be affected are those least likely to make a noise or effect the political status quo, such as homeless people, drug users, immigrant people etc.

I completely agree, the funding and support for services to marginalised people are inadequate and policies are short-sighted and driven more by a 'shut the fuck up' ethos than a 'let's make society fairer' ethos, even when the economy is thriving. It's not like for the last ten years homeless people have been doing well or anything, but what happens is that funding is cut, while inflation continues to inflate (or whatever...). Let me be specific here.

The number of homeless people increases, inflation increases while the funding remains stagnant. Do you really think this doesn't effect the services that homeless people can access? Does my point about the fact that there are 30-40 more people a night being told they have to stay on the street not point to the downturn in the economy having an effect on homeless people?

There is a drinkers shelter in town. It is unhealthy, dangerous and pretty deflating place to be. There are two new shelters built and ready to open up to accommodate the people who live in the drinkers shelter but the HSE have not allocated funding for staff and so at least one of those shelters that would offer support to entrenched and aging drinkers will not be opened. There is a day centre in town that is badly needed for active drug users built and ready to open... because funding by the HSE has been pulled, they do
not have the staff to open this vital service.

I could go on dude....many staff are not getting increments or increases and morale is lowering in the services in general. This is only the beginning of this shit. I, for one, am moving under the sea before my heart *actually* breaks.

Or what she said

 

[flashback]

where does all this money go? you know, these billions that were lost?

There is going to be 2 or maybe three less Stealth Bombers bought this quarter.

AHHHH no, only messing. No no. The Stealth Bombers are grand.

No, ehh, yeah, I'd say there are going to be loads of hungry people having wars in Africa... or wait, emm, yeah so the CO2 levels in the atmosphere are not going to be sorted out by September after all... no no, I mean, emm, homeless shelters are going to start being underfunded.


Nah. Singapore. All the missing money ends up in Singapore and Abu Dubai. They'll be keeping a close eye on it until they reckon we can be trusted again.