It was definitely both of these?
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US Election 2020 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Lili Marlene
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It was definitely both of these?
- Thread starter
- #1,322
You should read the article I posted up there.
My thoughts are it was a riot, not a coup in any real sense. It didn't have the planning of an actual coup and it had all the in-the-moment energy of a riot. The "intention to take prisoners" is one thing, actually taking them is another, and considering half of the guys there were building their own brand on social media, posing in your camo outfit and owning cable-ties isn't proof of an awful lot.
Also they had no demands bar "stop the steal" and "it's not fair."
I'm not against calling it a coup, it was just a particularly pathetic attempt at one. If the CIA incited a bunch of people in a South American country to storm their capitol in fancy dress and walk around taking selfies and stealing shit it'd be comedy story of the week and no one would be clutching their pearls over the 3 or 4 deaths.
My thoughts are it was a riot, not a coup in any real sense. It didn't have the planning of an actual coup and it had all the in-the-moment energy of a riot. The "intention to take prisoners" is one thing, actually taking them is another, and considering half of the guys there were building their own brand on social media, posing in your camo outfit and owning cable-ties isn't proof of an awful lot.
Also they had no demands bar "stop the steal" and "it's not fair."
I'm not against calling it a coup, it was just a particularly pathetic attempt at one. If the CIA incited a bunch of people in a South American country to storm their capitol in fancy dress and walk around taking selfies and stealing shit it'd be comedy story of the week and no one would be clutching their pearls over the 3 or 4 deaths.
The lads who ran the incident got tours of the Capitol from Republicans the day before the event.
There was a lad with 11 petrol/napalm bombs (but not really, he'd dissolved styrofoam in petrol to make it a kind of jelly), and a number of guns had a list of targets. They were communicating about who they wanted once they were in the building, and one of Republicans was live tweeting the location of Pelosi (the same Rep that gave a number of them the guided tour the previous day).
They had maps of the place that they distributed (for those that didn't get the tour the previous day).
They had cops on duty that day that would normally not have been there, and who assisted, so much so that during officials were telling them not to trust any cops you don't personally know or recognize.
The stuff that's coming in from that Parler thing suggests details on how they'd be planning exactly this.
The Proud Bois organized that they would not wear their uniforms so they could blend in more easily during the event.
There was a riot, but in addition to that it was planned.
There was a lad with 11 petrol/napalm bombs (but not really, he'd dissolved styrofoam in petrol to make it a kind of jelly), and a number of guns had a list of targets. They were communicating about who they wanted once they were in the building, and one of Republicans was live tweeting the location of Pelosi (the same Rep that gave a number of them the guided tour the previous day).
They had maps of the place that they distributed (for those that didn't get the tour the previous day).
They had cops on duty that day that would normally not have been there, and who assisted, so much so that during officials were telling them not to trust any cops you don't personally know or recognize.
The stuff that's coming in from that Parler thing suggests details on how they'd be planning exactly this.
The Proud Bois organized that they would not wear their uniforms so they could blend in more easily during the event.
There was a riot, but in addition to that it was planned.
snakybus
Well-Known Member
I wonder what music they listen to. I bet there's a lot of Iron Maiden and Lynyrd Skynyrd in their playlists. And Jamiroquai.
What it's increasingly reminding me of is the way CIA orchestrated the Mosaddegh coup.
They funded and ran a sustained campaign of enabling useful idiots to go out and wreck things. It looked like it was futile, but the fact that the idiots kept it up for so long eventually ended up in them winning. There was orchestrating from the CIA, but the majority of what happened was unplanned and intended to just cause chaos, close down the normal systems, suspend parliament, and eventually drag him out of the place.
They funded and ran a sustained campaign of enabling useful idiots to go out and wreck things. It looked like it was futile, but the fact that the idiots kept it up for so long eventually ended up in them winning. There was orchestrating from the CIA, but the majority of what happened was unplanned and intended to just cause chaos, close down the normal systems, suspend parliament, and eventually drag him out of the place.
- Thread starter
- #1,326
aka The Jakarta Method.What it's increasingly reminding me of is the way CIA orchestrated the Mosaddegh coup.
They funded and ran a sustained campaign of enabling useful idiots to go out and wreck things. It looked like it was futile, but the fact that the idiots kept it up for so long eventually ended up in them winning. There was orchestrating from the CIA, but the majority of what happened was unplanned and intended to just cause chaos, close down the normal systems, suspend parliament, and eventually drag him out of the place.
but who is the CIA and who is Mosaddegh and who is the USA in this comparison?
Fine it was planned and even with the cops going incredibly soft on them them they achieved none of their goals. No one was taken prisoner, nothing was occupied, no demands were made, a complete and utter failure from start to finish.
David Kronenbourg
Well-Known Member
Kid Rock I reckon
I was more sort of saying that sustained idiocy and unfocused or barely focused violence can work. I'd not be drawing exact analogues with specific people or groups. I didn't know it was called the Jakarta Method, maybe that would be the more accurate way of describing it.
But yeah, the Mosaddegh stuff was a total failure, and an embarrassment to K Roosevelt and the CIA, until it wasn't. I guess my point is it went from being a joke to getting him dragged out and murdered.
Well, these things (coups/revolutions) do not begin and end in an afternoon. I think there is usually a build up of momentum and eventually the military have to decide where their best interest lie - with a New MAGA Order or with the libs.
Mossadegh died years later under house arrest so it's not all worst case scenario stuff for Pelosi here
I mean, also yeah. I don't see there actually being a coup. I don't see the Biden inaug getting bombed.
But I also didn't think they'd actually get into the Capitol and kill people, despite the fact that's what they said they were going to do.
Now they are saying they are going to attack the inauguration. Shrug.
But I also didn't think they'd actually get into the Capitol and kill people, despite the fact that's what they said they were going to do.
Now they are saying they are going to attack the inauguration. Shrug.
- Thread starter
- #1,332
On the one hand i'm like "I wish the FBI would actually break up these white supremacist idiots" and on the other I remember that the US works happily with Nazis in the Ukraine and the FBI are probably on the side of the white supremacist idiots.
You can't stop the New MAGA Order by appealing to the co-founders of the New MAGA order whose only difference is they call it The New International Solidarity Order and they appoint a few people of color so they couldn't possibly be racist, Priti Patel style.
You can't stop the New MAGA Order by appealing to the co-founders of the New MAGA order whose only difference is they call it The New International Solidarity Order and they appoint a few people of color so they couldn't possibly be racist, Priti Patel style.
Fuck it, what do I care, they're going to attack the capitol. What is the solution here? Are we still calling for the defunding of the police or no?
sorry, you're right. I was getting my CIA coups mixed up. I might have been Allende that ended up shot when they stormed the place.
Although I checked and it seems like he might have shot himself before they could get their hands on him.
Misremembered that. Apologies.
Cormcolash
Well-Known Member
You mean like the Bay of Pigs, or like those lads that tried to take over Venezuela from a motor boat last year?
- Thread starter
- #1,335
that's what i was thinking of, yeah, although they were Americans?
Remember yer one with the massive bible in Bolivia though?
They were I think. They were former military / forces types from... surprise... the US.
Cormcolash
Well-Known Member
Do your men always operate on the wrong side of the border?
I think in her defense that was a Crocodile Dundee "That's not a boi-bel, THAT'S a boi-bel" callback she was pulling there.
Thankfully now we don't normally dispatch Americans to do the overseas killing. We've got drones.
Progress, baby.
David Kronenbourg
Well-Known Member
Anyone watching the debate?
www.c-span.org
House Session, Part 1
The House convened briefly for the prayer and Pledge of Allegiance and then recessed, subject to the call of the chair.
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