Public versus Private Sector (4 Viewers)

[aoboa]

Question for anyone in private sector:
Have you taken a pay cut? And, if so, was it needed or was it an opportunistic measure taken by the company because there was an excuse to do so?

 

[Moods For Mallards]

Pay freeze here.
I don't think it was opportunistic - at least not mostly that.

 

[Unicron]

When people say "reorganise the public sector" and "eliminate inefficiencies" they mean "a bunch of people should be shitcanned" right?

 

[Squiggle]

Question for anyone in private sector:
Have you taken a pay cut? And, if so, was it needed or was it an opportunistic measure taken by the company because there was an excuse to do so?

Pay freeze and no bonus paid last year, probably none paid this year either. Result was a net cut in pay for everyone. There has been a downturn in our sector of the economy but there has been no corresponding cut in the Directors' salaries, expenses or perks, they have increased yet again this year.

As with the public sector all the trimming is being done on the bottom instead of where most needed, at the top.

 

[Froog]

pay freeze here, totally opportunistic, the company could easily afford raises and even bonuses. massive "restructuring" too with lots of jobs gone. pretty much the same for the high up guys aswell tho.

 

[Thebeard]

My mates two cents:

"
The amount of money being spent has to be reduced, the country will be officially bust if we don't. The public sector wage bill, being part of this, has to be reduced in turn but I'm not sure where exactly. Personally I would imagine that the administration side of things could be targeted. You can't take nurses, teachers, and especially the likes of paramedics off the front line but I would imagine there would be scope for the back office roles to be reduced. In tandem with this an increase in taxes/levees across the board should also be considered.

I have not experienced any hostility from private sector workers (e.g. colleagues, friends, family) towards their public sector counterparts. I think there is a lot of paranoia in the air. A lot of people want a strike no matter what, and I genuinely believe that these people are creating so much hysteria and trying to drive a wedge between the two.

I work in the private sector and I believe that I should probably pay a bit more tax and in turn the public sector get paid a little less. It's nothing personal but just try to balance the books."

 

[Moods For Mallards]

Pay freeze and no bonus paid last year, probably none paid this year either. Result was a net cut in pay for everyone. There has been a downturn in our sector of the economy but there has been no corresponding cut in the Directors' salaries, expenses or perks, they have increased yet again this year.

As with the public sector all the trimming is being done on the bottom instead of where most needed, at the top.

Actually, this is the exact same situation as my company, now that I actually think about it.
Pay freeze & bonuses stopped, except for directors.

 

[Moods For Mallards]

My mates two cents:

"
The amount of money being spent has to be reduced, the country will be officially bust if we don't. The public sector wage bill, being part of this, has to be reduced in turn but I'm not sure where exactly. Personally I would imagine that the administration side of things could be targeted. You can't take nurses, teachers, and especially the likes of paramedics off the front line but I would imagine there would be scope for the back office roles to be reduced. In tandem with this an increase in taxes/levees across the board should also be considered.

I have not experienced any hostility from private sector workers (e.g. colleagues, friends, family) towards their public sector counterparts. I think there is a lot of paranoia in the air. A lot of people want a strike no matter what, and I genuinely believe that these people are creating so much hysteria and trying to drive a wedge between the two.

I work in the private sector and I believe that I should probably pay a bit more tax and in turn the public sector get paid a little less. It's nothing personal but just try to balance the books."

Your mate must be on a different planet if he hasn't noticed the hostility to public sector workers. I hear it all the time from family, in particular, but also general heads about the place, in the canteen in work, etc.

 

[Thebeard]

Your mate must be on a different planet if he hasn't noticed the hostility to public sector workers. I hear it all the time from family, in particular, but also general heads about the place, in the canteen in work, etc.

I disagree with him as far as targeting the admin side of the public service too.

 

[hugh]

It's the private sector doing the giving out.
There's been a steady and heavy handed attack on the public sector in the media for the last year which has everyone in the private sector baying for the public sectors blood.

It's gonna result in another pay cut for the public sector in the next budget instead of the reform and reorganisation that the public sector really needs. The pay cut will make the government look like they're doing something while failing to address the real issues. The private sector will be sated while the majority of the public sector will be screwed and a huge amount of people will have less money to spend in a f**ked economy.
Meanwhile the majority of state agencies will still be bloated, top heavy and inefficient.

BTW: I don't work in the public sector either.

I do, and aoboa's above summary of the situation is spot on.

Choosing to implement McCarthy's recommendations while ignoring the report from the Commission on Taxation is such a cynical move. It's basically "instead of raising taxes which will piss off everyone equally, let's screw the public sector ... better for our prospects in the next election to have a minority of the population mad at us than the whole lot. And in addition to that, let's not bother trying to figure out how we can deliver the same or better services for less money, let's just cut everyone's pay again .. that's a lot easier".

 

[aoboa]

Your mate must be on a different planet if he hasn't noticed the hostility to public sector workers. I hear it all the time from family, in particular, but also general heads about the place, in the canteen in work, etc.

Yeah - just take a look at boards.ie for an idea of the amount of hate being expressed.
People are missing the point completely.

 

[Red_Dog]

Maybe we should just get rid of secondary school and bring back the workhouse!

 

[Froog]

lets make everyone a public sector worker!

 

[mr pharmacist!!!!1]

8%

 

[aoboa]

When people say "reorganise the public sector" and "eliminate inefficiencies" they mean "a bunch of people should be shitcanned" right?

Unfortunately yes.
But that's what's wrong, far more so than people being paid too much.
The PS is top heavy with a huge amount of duplication of roles and even departments. People need to realise that baying for an across the board pay cut will do nothing long term bar keep a bunch of idiots who buy into the 'public sector are evil' stance happy. Sure the state will save money but what will the knock on effects to the economy be?
The whole thing needs to be reformed which will take 20 years but no ones got the balls or brains to tackle it.

It's the same with people screaming for the dole to be cut across the board. Again the whole system needs to be reformed. I'd love to see a system that encouraged people to work i.e. good help when you lose your job for a year and then decreasing payments over a period of a few years until you're effectively cut off. People who can't work for health or other such reasons get looked after by the HSE or something. The system we have at the moment is insane. But again people will be sated if everyone gets their dole cut by 5% including people who recently lost their jobs but have been paying stamps for years. A system like the one I mention above would save billions - billions which could be put into support services for workers like subsidised childcare etc. Proper reform of the social services would take 20 years too but again it's not a vote winner so no one bothers.

I'm sick of the whole thing.

 

[magnetize]

Yeah - just take a look at boards.ie for an idea of the amount of hate being expressed.
People are missing the point completely.

politics.ie is the spot if you want to see some real hardcore toolbaggery.

the whole thing is encapsulated by mary coughlan & john o'donoghue. fill your pockets or those of the connected elite, brazen it out & get cheered on when you go back to your constituency by the sheep that think its great to have 'one of our own up there'...

 

[ann post]

i'm more speculative about these things then well informed, but i just spent ten minutes reading about toyota on wikipedia, and i think i've come up with a solution for just about everything wrong with ireland. my plan is loosely derived from this

ANN POST'S IRELAND OUTLINE RECOVERY PLAN

for the sake of argument, I'm going to pretend ireland is a company, which needs to export product to gain revenue to keeps its internal administration, education and services afloat, rather then a bottomless pit of credit.

1. Base your management decisions on a long-term philosophy, even at the expense of short-term goals
2. Create continuous process flow to bring problems to the surface
3. Use "pull" systems to avoid overproduction
4. Level out the workload
5. Build a culture of stopping to fix problems, to get quality right the first time
6. Standardized tasks are the foundation for continuous improvement and employee empowerment
7. Use visual control so no problems are hidden
8. Use only reliable, thoroughly tested technology that serves your people and processes
9. Grow leaders who thoroughly understand the work, live the philosophy, and teach it to others
10. Develop exceptional people and teams who follow your company’s philosophy
11. Respect your extended network of partners and suppliers by challenging them and helping them improve
12. Go and see for yourself to thoroughly understand the situation (genchi genbutsu)
13. Make decisions slowly by consensus, thoroughly considering all options; implement decisions rapidly
14. Become a learning organization through relentless reflection and continuous improvement

 

[aoboa]

politics.ie is the spot if you want to see some real hardcore toolbaggery.

the whole thing is encapsulated by mary coughlan & john o'donoghue. fill your pockets or those of the connected elite, brazen it out & get cheered on when you go back to your constituency by the sheep that think its great to have 'one of our own up there'...

I've only really browsed through some there and on boards but what I did read made me sick to my stomach. It's unsettling and upsetting that so many people are so shortsighted and ignorant.

 

[Red_Dog]

Hey what if I ran for office and my whole campaign was based on the fact that I was willing to do the job of a td for the say 25,000 a year , would it make me feel like a big shot?

 

[hugh]

for the sake of argument, I'm going to pretend ireland is a company ....

Yeah I can see an immediate flaw here right from the start ...