Prostitution Poll (3 Viewers)

[Froog]

is it okay if the prostitute uses the money for booze?

 

[Mormon Nailer]

This is pretty much what I was gonna post. Violence and trafficking and exploitations are already crimes, so there's no reason to criminalise something considered 'immoral' (which I'm inclined just to say that, I dunno, I don't think a single set of moral standards has ever been useful or productive or even successful and certainly shouldn't necessarily be synonymous with law) because it also can be associated with illegal behaviour.

But any change you make to the law affects the environment for both the trafficed girl and the girl who has the freedom to make a deliberate decision.

Something that has always bothered me about the outright legalising of prostitution - was that it is really just a terrible hard harted indifference to suffering, tarted up with freedom of conscience bollox.

If legalising doesn't undercut the market for trafficked women but increases increases it, and doesn't make life any easier for them - ultimately as the environment around them is made more permissive their lot is made worse not better - is it right to say; these are two different problems, legalise away?

 

[GO]

I agree with maims bond on this.

 

[maims bond]

Something that has always bothered me about the outright legalising of prostitution - was that it is really just a terrible hard harted indifference to suffering, tarted up with freedom of conscience bollox.

What about the suffering of cold call sales workers after they legalised that kind of business, what about their suffering?

I'm being flippant but what i'm getting at is that there are many jobs people do which they would regard as demeaning or have to suffer through. But they're perfectly legal.

 

[GO]

I used to know a male prostitute a few years back.He did'nt mind it tbh.

 

[Mormon Nailer]

What about the suffering of cold call sales workers after they legalised that kind of business, what about their suffering?

I'm being flippant but what i'm getting at is that there are many jobs people do which they would regard as demeaning or have to suffer through. But they're perfectly legal.

Big internationl traffic in cold callers is there?

There are more slaves now in the world than there has been at any other point in history and trafficking of women for sex has huge part of this.

The day your family sell you into a call centre, you have you pasport taken, you are beaten etc, let me know and I'll admit you have a point.

 

[Carlow Punks!]

What is up with the poll?

I voted on one thing, but now the question and answers have changed arbitrarily, but with original voters still counted as having voted on a question that didn't exist while they cast their votes, and actually might have the opposite meaning to what they voted on.

According to this when asked "Where do you stand on prostitution?" I answered "no".

What the fuck does that mean even?!

Where do you stand on prostitution? No.

This is Mugabe-esque vote rigging. I want UN observers on this poll.

 

[maims bond]

What is up with the poll?

I voted on one thing, but now the question and answers have changed arbitrarily, but with original voters still counted as having voted on a question that didn't exist while they cast their votes, and actually might have the opposite meaning to what they voted on.

According to this when asked "Where do you stand on prostitution?" I answered "no".

What the fuck does that mean even?!

Where do you stand on prostitution? No.

This is Mugabe-esque vote rigging. I want UN observers on this poll.

As a subscriber i want to see heads roll for this debacle. Someone other than me is changing the poll, I assume a moderator. Can we have the question and options as follows:

Is prostitution immoral?

Yes or No.

Also, those who said 'I'm game' to the previous answer are now listed as having said 'no'.

Nailer, i respectfully suggest that you are confusing the moral question of prostitution with the drugs and exploitation. They are two completely separate issues.

 

[Mormon Nailer]

Nailer, i respectfully suggest that you are confusing the moral question of prostitution with the drugs and exploitation. They are two completely separate issues.

I'm not confusing them, I'm saying you can't realistically separate them.

 

[pete]

the poll answers are the right way around and have always been the right way round. anyone who says different is just mistaken. and possibly banned.

 

[ann post]

Inspired by the virgin auction thread. Is it a case of individual liberty or forced labour through economic necessity? I suspect, although this may not be the case, that those who are in favour of abortion would frown upon prostitution. However, seems to me that the 'choice' principle is applicable to both arguments.

the initial poll question makes no sense to me.

yes i stand on prostitution
no i dont stand on prostitution.

i'd be pro legalistation if it were such a case that protected the prostitutes legally and physically. i can imagine although that article/book argues that some flee to the west expecting to become a prostitute, many probably arrive and a few weeks later are like 'fuck this, i made a bad choice and i cant get out'.

 

[maims bond]

the poll answers are the right way around and have always been the right way round. anyone who says different is just mistaken. and possibly banned.

I thought we were at war with Eurasia....whatever.

"I'm not confusing them, I'm saying you can't realistically separate them."

Sorry, but it appears patently obvious to me that there are instances of them being separated. Not all prostitutes are under duress or drug addicts. Some choose it as a profession and the poll is seeking to establish whether people thing this is right or wrong.

 

[therealjohnny]

the poll answers are the right way around and have always been the right way round. anyone who says different is just mistaken. and possibly banned.

I'm with Pete on this

 

[ann post]

SRSLY GUYZ

when somone starts a question with 'where', how the fuck is 'yes' or 'no' a valid response.

where do your allegiances lie??? YES
where is the cat??? NO
where is the grammatical structure??? YES

 

[jane]

But any change you make to the law affects the environment for both the trafficed girl and the girl who has the freedom to make a deliberate decision.

Something that has always bothered me about the outright legalising of prostitution - was that it is really just a terrible hard harted indifference to suffering, tarted up with freedom of conscience bollox.

If legalising doesn't undercut the market for trafficked women but increases increases it, and doesn't make life any easier for them - ultimately as the environment around them is made more permissive their lot is made worse not better - is it right to say; these are two different problems, legalise away?

I think it would be easy to overestimate any positive consequences that would come from decriminalising (as opposed to making into a legit business with regulations, the difference between opening a shop and selling some of your shit on eBay).

I mean, lapdancing, glamour modelling, and porno acting are all legal and it's the attitudes that a lot of people would have toward people in these industries that might cause some to think it's okay to be violent or exploit them. They are also kind of plagued (except maybe for glamour modelling, which is creepy) by the inability to agree on what we mean by 'free choice'. They also are problematic to most feminists (including me).

So yeah, I don't know. I mean, it's not an easy answer. It's reality, and reality can never really be addressed with a simple change to the legal system. I know that sounds really dismissive, but I genuinely haven't a clue.

I don't think it's freedom of conscience stuff, though. It's more just not unfairly punishing someone for reasons of allegedly compromising public morality which, regardless of how the laws are sometimes used, is the basis of their existence. And probably they were never flouted more than during the days of the Monto. The Monto!

Prostitutes used to be 'rescued' from the Monto and often locked up in Lock Hospitals (the Markievicz centre is on the site of one of them), where they would be treated with mercury (whether or not they wanted to be) and then either set to the laundries or to a longer-term facility. Sometimes they would be back out on the street. They were rarely arrested, but they didn't need to be when they were going to be deprived of their freedom anyway.

So I guess what I'm saying is that yes, they are different problems, but no, they are not totally unconnected or anything, and while legalisation doesn't solve anything, criminalisation can exacerbate existing problems. And really, I don't think legalisation is even the main issue for a lot of people who work with sex workers, it's more of an immediate concern to minimise harm and keep people safe.

I dunno if that's a lack of resources to lobby for legalisation or what -- any of yis know more about this?

But as far as trafficked women go, as it stands, women who are trafficked to work in prostitution are technically criminals (although I'm pretty sure they don't try to prosecute them!). But because they are deprived of the right to free will, they are not responsible for their 'crime'. It changes nothing. Just as we see that people are trafficked for domestic work, for work in sweatshops and dodgy factory kitchens and shit, or those who come with the promise of a job that turns out to be virtually slave-like. Even though the job might be something otherwise legal.

 

[Pantone247]

Be advised that this is a public poll: other users can see the choice(s) you selected.

yeah that's going to get a valid honest opinion from folks, nice wan

 

[maims bond]

SRSLY GUYZ

when somone starts a question with 'where', how the fuck is 'yes' or 'no' a valid response.

where do your allegiances lie??? YES
where is the cat??? NO
where is the grammatical structure??? YES

all correspondences to Pete.

 

[maims bond]

yeah that's going to get a valid honest opinion from folks, nice wan

you mean you don't think you can be honest about your opinion on prostitution? why not? i've created a monster, someone talk about boards.ie

 

[Carlow Punks!]

all correspondences to Pete.

Where exactly do we send correspondences? No.


Edit: just saw the yes and no have been changed around in the poll. we complainers are getting our way (partially). no phone calls to Joe Duffy needed.

 

[Pantone247]

you mean you don't think you can be honest about your opinion on prostitution? why not?

because I don't want too?