The Russian invasion of Ukraine (10 Viewers)

[hydromancer]

The coal burned in my parents' gaff is polish.

Sure I wouldn't think Poland is as big of a producer of coal as it used to be.

 

[magicbastarder]

Moneypoint is sorta connected to aughinish alumina for the meantime - alumina is a super high energy form of mining.

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[hydromancer]

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Elon Musk has gotten involved

 

[seanc]

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Some Roma in Ukraine steal a Russian tank. Can't find a better video, but my Romanian friend brought this to my attention, he thought I'd like it because of where I'm from.

He doesn't like Roma, but suddenly, in this video, he seemed quite proud of his fellow sort-of Romanian travelling people.


And in all fairness, good scrap value on those Russian tanks.

​

 

[Jerry Twig]

ok whatever

Good man, proving the Thumped maxim in just two words!

 

[hydromancer]

‘Yes, He Would’: Fiona Hill on Putin and Nukes

Putin is trying to take down the entire world order, the veteran Russia watcher said in an interview. But there are ways even ordinary Americans can fight back.

www.politico.com

 

[therealjohnny]

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Some Roma in Ukraine steal a Russian tank. Can't find a better video, but my Romanian friend brought this to my attention, he thought I'd like it because of where I'm from.

He doesn't like Roma, but suddenly, in this video, he seemed quite proud of his fellow sort-of Romanian travelling people.


And in all fairness, good scrap value on those Russian tanks.

​

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[rettucs]

Should they fight with nazis? Na

fair enough if thats your position but theres a big difference fighting with nazis and fighting for nazis. I'd put a lot of stock in the saying 'the enemy of your enemy is your friend'. I think the example of the Germans in 1916 is case in point.

Incidentally, the Latvian army (the reserve army at least) wear a swastika on their uniform. That symbol has different meaning here to the rest of the world.

 

[ann post]

I'm swaying between 'he's over extended himself and will be overthrown' and 'he's gonna goad the world into this and then really do damage' about once or twice a day so far.

 

[seanc]

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That's just blank for me...bad link maybe?

 

[therealjohnny]

That's just blank for me...bad link maybe?

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[flashback]

If Putin gets removed from leadership I'd imagine he might end up dead fairly quickly afterwards. Dictators usually don't go quietly. He has a lot of enemies, and if anything I'd imagine his paranoia amplifies this.

So let's say he knows if he loses this thing he'll end up out of power, and likely dead. Therefore he cannot lose this, and if loss starts looking more likely from his perspective it makes no difference whether he uses nukes or not, whether he commits massive war crimes or not. He's been walking himself into a corner, he's a psychopath, with nuclear weapons.

Meaning you're back into the Trump scenario: if the addled cunt makes the call do the generals listen?

 

[magicbastarder]

maybe the relevant general will get a phone call from abramovitch stating that 'if my prized yacht is vaporised in a nuclear blast, i will be *most* displeased, please bear that in mind'.

 

[JohnnyRaz]

If Putin gets removed from leadership I'd imagine he might end up dead fairly quickly afterwards. Dictators usually don't go quietly. He has a lot of enemies, and if anything I'd imagine his paranoia amplifies this.

So let's say he knows if he loses this thing he'll end up out of power, and likely dead. Therefore he cannot lose this, and if loss starts looking more likely from his perspective it makes no difference whether he uses nukes or not, whether he commits massive war crimes or not. He's been walking himself into a corner, he's a psychopath, with nuclear weapons.

Meaning you're back into the Trump scenario: if the addled cunt makes the call do the generals listen?

Yep - there's no incentive for him to back down, or gradually relinquish power. the opposite in both cases.

I'd say if he retired he'd encounter some polonium tea fairly shortly thereafter.

 

[flashback]

maybe the relevant general will get a phone call from abramovitch stating that 'if my prized yacht is vaporised in a nuclear blast, i will be *most* displeased, please bear that in mind'.

this is what I've been wondering for a long time. Does the dog wag the tail or the tail wag the dog?
Who's actually in charge in that relationship. I'd have said probably Putin, he can make or kill/imprison you, as he'd demonstrated.
But if the oligarchs aligned themselves could they pull the rug out from underneath things?

The other hopeful way out would be if the Russian army,security forces, public, stop cooperating. This is a big ask.

 

[ann post]

But if the oligarchs aligned themselves could they pull the rug out from underneath things?

I'd imagine they prefer when things are just trundling them into the stratosphere of wealth rather than being sanctioned and hounded.

 

[egg_]

Yep - there's no incentive for him to back down, or gradually relinquish power. the opposite in both cases.

I'd say if he retired he'd encounter some polonium tea fairly shortly thereafter.

Kruschev got pushed out back in the day without violence didn't he?

 

[flashback]

Yep - there's no incentive for him to back down, or gradually relinquish power. the opposite in both cases.

I'd say if he retired he'd encounter some polonium tea fairly shortly thereafter.

So how do you play it from the EU/US perspective. They can't be seen to be doing the fighting, and they themselves can't do the fighting. I'd imagine the US in particular is able to see exactly what's going on in Ukraine in roughly real time.
I guess one phenotype of US military co operation might be convoys of Russian mil vehicles ending up destroyed on the regular. If I was US mil, and I could guarantee nothing would get back to US (which is probably difficult) I'd be running drones along the convoys and taking out the head and tail to slow things up, with the hope the Ukrainians can finish the job up. Along with giving Ukraine intel.

Another trick I'd be thinking about would be making it known that every Russian fighter who quits gets 10 grand in the hand, no questions asked. I'd be running every campaign possible to pull apart the Russian military from within.

 

[JohnnyRaz]

Kruschev got pushed out back in the day without violence didn't he?

He was the exception in the soviet era They even tried to oust gobachev

 

[flashback]

Kruschev got pushed out back in the day without violence didn't he?

Pinochet did too, probably with the direct help of Thatcher / Reagan.

I wouldn't categorize Khrushchev with Putin. Khrushchev took a USSR from fucked to slightly less fucked. Even stuff people like to criticize him for like Cuban missile crisis was pretty rational from his perspective. JFK was waving his dick around like a hard case, and Khrushchev asked him to please stop.


edit - sorry, didn't mean to imply Thatcher / US pushed Pinochet out. They didn't. But they did ensure he had a safe rest of his life I'd say.