Let's have a debate about immigration (1 Viewer)

[egg_]

We can't lose something we don't really have. What is Irishness? I view cultural identity as something that is fluid

Ah dudes, I'm not talking about cultural identity, dammit! I'm talking about civilisation - the unspoken agreement we all have that limits how nasty we can be to one another. The thing that enables you to work at a job, get paid on time, save up a few hundred quid of that money in your credit union account, take the money out in cash and walk down the street with it in your pocket and give in exchange for something you want and carry that home on the bus and keep it until you don't want it anymore, all without having to worry (too much) about it being taken from you somewhere along the way. Most people in the world can't count on being able to do that.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

Ah dudes, I'm not talking about cultural identity, dammit! I'm talking about civilisation - the unspoken agreement we all have that limits how nasty we can be to one another

is it not the law that controls this kinda thing? if you're nasty to me then im telling.

 

[Space]

Great, tell me the answer.

Only Donegal people know the answer. I've only got honoury donegal person status so I can't give out the answer, ask Johnny.

As for the immigration debate, who are we to stop people coming here? We've been sending missionaries(these days its outsourced production and western "ideals") to a lot of these countries destroying their culture for a long time now. We also have a standard of living only achieved by fucking over other countries for cheap labour/raw materials.

 

[Squiggle]

Irishness is something we pretend we give a shit about so that rich tourists wil waddle into our shops and spend mucho dinera on cheap & obscene paraphernalia that in no way represents the thing we pretend to care about.

I think this is the best definition I've seen. Fridge magnet anyone - only €1.99 each.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

I think this is the best definition I've seen. Fridge magnet anyone - only €1.99 each.

which is the best carrolls outlet? i'd love to take a big stick to those speakers they having blaring shite music out onto the street but society wont allow me

 

[Squiggle]

Ah dudes, I'm not talking about cultural identity, dammit! I'm talking about civilisation - the unspoken agreement we all have that limits how nasty we can be to one another. The thing that enables you to work at a job, get paid on time, save up a few hundred quid of that money in your credit union account, take the money out in cash and walk down the street with it in your pocket and give in exchange for something you want and carry that home on the bus and keep it until you don't want it anymore, all without having to worry (too much) about it being taken from you somewhere along the way. Most people in the world can't count on being able to do that.

Do you honestly think we have that? I don't think this country is a particularly nice place, or filled with nice people. I've been robbed several times, most people on Thumped seem to have been physically assaulted by strangers at some point in their life. If anything the immigrants that I've encountered are more polite, honest and hardworking than most of the locals in the area of Dublin that I live in.

If you ask me, they show us up.

 

[ann post]

i want to build a wall between donegal and the future/present. straight after i teach the world to sing. is ireland still part of donegal or did we hand it to the brits in the 90's?? i cant remember.

 

[broken arm]

Ah dudes, I'm not talking about cultural identity, dammit! I'm talking about civilisation - the unspoken agreement we all have that limits how nasty we can be to one another. The thing that enables you to work at a job, get paid on time, save up a few hundred quid of that money in your credit union account, take the money out in cash and walk down the street with it in your pocket and give in exchange for something you want and carry that home on the bus and keep it until you don't want it anymore, all without having to worry (too much) about it being taken from you somewhere along the way. Most people in the world can't count on being able to do that.

it's all smoke and mirrors. e.g. if you're bank went bust tomorrow you'd be wrecking the gaff and robbing food from grannies to feed your kids. etc.

 

[Squiggle]

If anything the immigrants that I've encountered are more polite, honest and hardworking than most of the locals in the area of Dublin that I live in.

If you ask me, they show us up.

!bing

We need an exchange programme. We ship one inmate, long-term unempolyed or repeat offender for every 10 immigrants that we take in, it would save the exchequer a fortune!

 

[broken arm]

!bing

We need an exchange programme. We ship one inmate, long-term unempolyed or repeat offender for every 10 immigrants that we take in, it would save the exchequer a fortune!

eh, how about one politician for every ten immigrants.

 

[Pantone247]

Ah dudes, I'm not talking about cultural identity, dammit! I'm talking about civilisation - the unspoken agreement we all have that limits how nasty we can be to one another. The thing that enables you to work at a job, get paid on time, save up a few hundred quid of that money in your credit union account, take the money out in cash and walk down the street with it in your pocket and give in exchange for something you want and carry that home on the bus and keep it until you don't want it anymore, all without having to worry (too much) about it being taken from you somewhere along the way. Most people in the world can't count on being able to do that.

do you think immigrants are threatening your freedom to do that?

could you stand in front of this burning cross while you answer?

 

[Squiggle]

eh, how about one politician for every ten immigrants.

That would work too, but can we include Solicitors as well, and Chuggers?

 

[classic seanc]

Only Donegal people know the answer. I've only got honoury donegal person status so I can't give out the answer, ask Johnny.

Johnnystress, what the fuck do chicken ranches have to do with anything?

 

[RSJ]

Irishness is something we pretend we give a shit about so that rich tourists wil waddle into our shops and spend mucho dinera on cheap & obscene paraphernalia that in no way represents the thing we pretend to care about.

Hmmm, i'd say maybe that's some people's definition of irishness. I'm sure there's far more people (those into GAA, trad and all that kinda business) that would totally disagree. Don't mistake your lack of connection with something for it's not existing.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

Johnnystress, what the fuck do chicken ranches have to do with anything?

pretend you're not interested - that'll kill them and they'll just have to tell you

 

[egg_]

Do you honestly think we have that?

Yes, yes, yes
You can be as cynical as you like, squiggle, but we do. g-stereotypical getting punched in the face on O'Connell St doesn't somehow invalidate the fact that, in Ireland, you usually don't have to fight to hold on to what you've got

I don't think this country is a particularly nice place, or filled with nice people.

Neither do I, not at all. But we have a society that allows us to get along without everyone having to be a philantropist

 

[egg_]

it's all smoke and mirrors. e.g. if you're bank went bust tomorrow you'd be wrecking the gaff and robbing food from grannies to feed your kids. etc.

Of course it's smoke and mirrors. But it's that smoke and those mirrors that make Ireland an easier place to live in than Sudan

 

[egg_]

do you think immigrants are threatening your freedom to do that?

Not directly, but if there were enough people in the country who didn't take that for granted, then maybe we wouldn't have it anymore.

Maybe. I don't know. What do you think?

 

[Squiggle]

Yes, yes, yes
You can be as cynical as you like, squiggle, but we do. g-stereotypical getting punched in the face on O'Connell St doesn't somehow invalidate the fact that, in Ireland, you usually don't have to fight to hold on to what you've got


Neither do I, not at all. But we have a society that allows us to get along without everyone having to be a philantropist

I'm not being cynical, it is actually very much a reality of life in Ireland that you do have to fight to hold on to what you've got. The only people who don't have to fight are those who have too much, or too little.

Communities are being destroyed by poor planning decisions that will allow the building of hundreds, even thousands of homes without first ensuring funding for infrastructure such as schools, medical centers, or even ensuring that the roads are going to be able to cope with the extra traffic. Small towns all over Ireland are having to fight to prevent that, and, in the majority of cases losing.

That is just one example... but there are many others. Agricultural industries such as dairy, fishing, market gardening and all the others, are fighting for survival - and losing.

Society allows you to get along, as long as you are doing what it wants and understands.

 

[flashback]

I would say that there is something that exists that is Irishness. It is not that thing that people put on to sell crap, there is a certain personality that is common to a lot of Irish people, its a real thing.

I notice it more we I am away from Ireland than when I am living there. Also, thumped reeks of it.

I would say that the people are not all that great and friendly in Ireland, we are grand-ish, but not that friendly. Chile for instance has far friendlier people.

Re Ireland is a shit hole dump etc etc. It's not. It just isn't. Its not the prettiest place on the planet, but its not a bad place, it has a hell of a lot going for it.
Live in New Jersey for a year, come back to me, and tell me Ireland is a dump. I dare yeh.