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Ann Post thinks you have ideas above your station if you want train service through Tyrone to DonegalThese puns are derailing the thread
This is interesting (it is just one poll and should get the respect one poll deserves)
So, do you think if you took away Brexit, and kept Corbyn's exact policies but with a different leader they would have won? i.e. If Johnson had been Labour leader would the much-more founded antisemitic claims you can make against him have not worked because everyone knows he has no actual values?
or do you think that three years of constant attacks with no real left voice in the British mainstream media (although the Mirror...) to fight your case are enough to wear support for anyone down because ultimately this is about who has the power/money and the answer is the right...
Genuinely unsure.
I think no matter who the Labour leader was the media would have moved heaven and earth to stop them getting into power.
I thought he came across as likable, decent, pragmatic and intelligent.I think They’d have a substantially better chance with anyone other than Corbyn running. He comes across awfully unlikeable in interviews.
Not Unlike the democrats losing against Trump because It was Hilary Poxy Clinton running for them
This is interesting (it is just one poll and should get the respect one poll deserves)
So, do you think if you took away Brexit, and kept Corbyn's exact policies but with a different leader they would have won? i.e. If Johnson had been Labour leader would the much-more founded antisemitic claims you can make against him have not worked because everyone knows he has no actual values?
or do you think that three years of constant attacks with no real left voice in the British mainstream media (although the Mirror...) to fight your case are enough to wear support for anyone down because ultimately this is about who has the power/money and the answer is the right...
Genuinely unsure.
I thought he came across as likable, decent, pragmatic and intelligent.
That's an end of history argument that doesn't hold much water anymore. HOWEVER, i'm not saying you're wrong when it comes to why people voted, after all so many are not happy but certainly willing to let their children die in a perfectly preventable climate apocalypse instead of making changes so why should they not pretend it's still the 90's and capitalism is fine. Or they've just gone full nihilism.Everything coming off from voxpops is that it was Corbyn
Not sure how you separate the man from the policies from the leader and so on
Anyone else in charge, particularly a centrist, would not have lost bread & butter Labour seats
The English got rid of socialism when they elected Thatcher and they have not wanted it back since
Blair knew that
Meaning that Corbyn may have been a bad leader, but he was also a bad leader with policies no one wants
Not to pile on, but he was completely AWOL in the 2016 referendum - because he's a Leaver - and let his party's voters down with a lack of leadership and clarity on the most important vote of their lifetime. He's as much to blame as anyone on the result.With all due respect Bernie, you’re fierce biased.
He comes across as an argumentative, on the fence, irritable grump that isn’t really interested in the job
I think if he lost the vote because of Brexit then the Lib Dems wouldn't have been wiped out though, no? Everyone in England who isn't a columnist wants to leave (patently not true, but you know what i'm getting at).Not to pile on, but he was completely AWOL in the 2016 referendum - because he's a Leaver - and let his party's voters down with a lack of leadership and clarity on the most important vote of their lifetime. He's as much to blame as anyone on the result.
Useless sod.
And he's been seen through.
Not the end of history, just the end of the post-war consensus.I can understand voting for a personality when your choices are Dems and Republicans or New Labour and Conservatives and the difference is marginal so you throw your hands up in the air because you know it makes no fucking difference, but in this case it just seems like a crazy thing to do. Not saying they didn't do it though.
That's an end of history argument that doesn't hold much water anymore. HOWEVER, i'm not saying you're wrong when it comes to why people voted, after all so many are not happy but certainly willing to let their children die in a perfectly preventable climate apocalypse instead of making changes so why should they not pretend it's still the 90's and capitalism is fine. Or they've just gone full nihilism.
hmmm
Yes, agreed. In 2019, Remain is a lost cause.I think if he lost the vote because of Brexit then the Lib Dems wouldn't have been wiped out though, no? Everyone in England who isn't a columnist wants to leave (patently not true, but you know what i'm getting at).
Well not right now no, I guess we'll see what happens over the next few years with all the young energy.Not the end of history, just the end of the post-war consensus.
State socialism broke Britain in the 70s, and people voted for Thatcher.
The country was fundamentally altered in the 80s.
Blair knew that that genie doesn't go back in the bottle.
Whatever comes next for England, it's not socialism.
Right yeah, probably actually.Yes, agreed. In 2019, Remain is a lost cause.
But I think the vote was on a knife edge in 2016 and Corbyn could have tipped the scales by simply doing his job as leader, but he did more or less fuck all. Cos he wanted out.
Everything since has flowed from that.
Just want a fairer society man, and don’t like seeing kids using foodbanks, and disabled people being forced to work until they die. Corbyn was the only leader offering anything to counter that shit.With all due respect Bernie, you’re fierce biased.
He comes across as an argumentative, on the fence, irritable grump that isn’t really interested in the job
Just want a fairer society man, and don’t like seeing kids using foodbanks, and disabled people being forced to work until they die. Corbyn was the only leader offering anything to counter that shit.
Silver-linings:
great view from here,
DUP no longer in charge up north,
Scots might get their independence and become an EU nation.
Scots might get their independence and become an EU nation.
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