Veggie/Vegan Punks where do you stand on abortion? (1 Viewer)

[Janer]

Weeler I think I did fairly well actually against the dozen or so.
I started this thread knowing I would get flak.......but hey the internet is fun!
And I am not anti woman lol, I just think the feminist ones are selfish and self centered when it comes to pregnancy.
And plz don't compare me to a parish priest just because we share maybe just the one thing in common.

 

[W.]

Weeler I think I did fairly well actually against the dozen or so.

You don't get to decide that. If you line up all your posts on this thread it reads like a 16 year old who just got his first internet connection.

And I am not anti woman lol, I just think the feminist ones are selfish and self centered when it comes to pregnancy.

You are entirely anti-woman and it's pretty blatant in the way you engage with female posters like nooly & jane.

And plz don't compare me to a parish priest just because we share maybe just the one thing in common.

You both share a common outlook that a woman's sexuality is in any way your business, do you believe in an immortal soul? If not then what part of killing a foetus do you object to?

 

[nooleen]

And I am not anti woman lol, I just think the feminist ones are selfish and self centered when it comes to pregnancy.

you clearly don't even know what a feminist is. 'female who disagrees with me' seems to be your definition.

 

[Janer]

A) My opinion differs to people yes.
B) Again don't be a tit....I would say it's the other way round!
C) I never said it was my business, I gave a view....of course I can't have any input in what a woman does.
After 6-7 weeks I object.

 

[Janer]

you clearly don't even know what a feminist is. 'female who disagrees with me' seems to be your definition.

Ok brains of Norwich. .|..|

 

[W.]

Immortal soul? Yes or no?

 

[Janer]

No.

 

[nooleen]

john paul or benedict?

 

[W.]

Then what attachment do you have to the undeveloped foetus?

 

[nooleen]

some kind of foetish.

 

[Janer]

Then what attachment do you have to the undeveloped foetus?

If your referring to me personally none.....as someone that has a view that it's wrong to abort because the foetus has developed a lot in the first 7-8 weeks etc then yes I have that view.

 

[D0njo]

padre pio did a wee-o

 

[Mormon Nailer]

Then what attachment do you have to the undeveloped foetus?

That's the most stupid argument I ever heard.
What the fuck have souls got to do with anything
Are you all going to start eating meat because animals dont have souls?
WTF!

 

[Carlow Punks!]

There is no such thing as a absolute right. There is always a competing right which it is balance against. Your right to free speech is balanced against peoples right not to be slandered etc etc

This is the case with any right you can mention.

And yet whenever the pro life case is put it is simply a case of - it's my right, fuck off, mind your own business and there is no cognisance given of any of the other competing rights even though they clearly exist.

I agree 100% that there is no such thing as absolute right, but in your (slightly smug) lecture there to all us 'hive-mind' punks have you should brought that idea to its natural /or perhaps parallel conclusion. That all rights are in fact artificial constructions of various societies.

Since you are obviously a reasonably smart guy please provide the argument that any rights (in particular those you discuss) are inalienable, without pointing to a higher celestial authority (Although if you are religious or spiritual in some manner let me know and your off the hook), or an intellectual construction by someone else.

I'm genuinely interested. See I kinda agree your point that abortion is about competing rights, but I think the weight given to those rights is a construction based on society, the individual etc. Much like the issue of meat eating. The only way to assume that a foetus/zygote/unborn etc has equal rights merely by its existence is if you believe in a higher celestial authority that you have deemed to have commanded thus, or you follow a constructed belief in inalienable rights, that has chosen to place equality before the law of all the born and unborn - which is fair enough, as long as you see its a construction and so allow others to hold their constructed set of beliefs which gives more rights to the mother. Maybe Nooly etc think its the inalienable right of a woman to decide what goes on inside her body.

So I see it as a competing set of rights and am pro-choice - due to my own constructed individual beliefs. Just as I don't believe killing someone is inalienably wrong in certain circumstances, but I do believe in a legal prohibitive to murder so as to keep society in balance etc.

but it brings me to another point..

The pro-abortion crowd just refuse to accept that not everyone shares their views.....

Like the anti-abortion crowd who are happy to just never have abortion themselves but allow legal access to anybody else wants to have them

 

[nooleen]

Are you all going to start eating meat because animals dont have souls?

that's the most stupid argument I ever heard (actually it's not, because that's a ridiculous statement). who ever said vegetarianism had anything to do with souls? and who are 'you all' supposed to be? more fantastic general board generalising.

 

[Corm]

Here Janer, you never answered whether you think women should have sex at all if they're not willing to have a baby?

Should a woman have sex if she's not willing to be pregnant?

Is it alright for girls to ride if they don't want to have a baby?

 

[Carlow Punks!]

Oh shit Mr. Cool Ice heard we were still debating the abortion issue after him telling us all to stop (and even though both me and Janer swore we were sick of it)

and he's pissed!

I'm getting back to my essay writing...fuck this shit for a while

 

[taubstumm]

I agree 100% that there is no such thing as absolute right, but in your (slightly smug) lecture there to all us 'hive-mind' punks have you should brought that idea to its natural /or perhaps parallel conclusion.

here, i was the one who used the phrase 'hive-mind punks'.

(the funny thing is that, more or less, i agree with you all. but it's funny to see how easily the ingroup bias can jump to the surface for people as supposedly independent-minded as the punx.)

anyway, it's just an aside; carry on.

 

[Mormon Nailer]

I agree 100% that there is no such thing as absolute right, but in your (slightly smug) lecture there to all us 'hive-mind' punks have you should brought that idea to its natural /or perhaps parallel conclusion. That all rights are in fact artificial constructions of various societies.

The hive mind thing wasn't me that was someone else.

I'm genuinely interested. See I kinda agree your point that abortion is about competing rights, but I think the weight given to those rights is a construction based on society, the individual etc. Much like the issue of meat eating. The only way to assume that a foetus/zygote/unborn etc has equal rights merely by its existence is if you believe in a higher celestial authority that you have deemed to have commanded thus, or you follow a constructed belief in inalienable rights, that has chosen to place equality before the law of all the born and unborn - which is fair enough, as long as you see its a construction and so allow others to hold their constructed set of beliefs which gives more rights to the mother. Maybe Nooly etc think its the inalienable right of a woman to decide what goes on inside her body.

I dont see how inalienable comes into it. I agree though that where the balance point is struck between these competing rights has a lot to do with society and the individual.

My point is that it is wrong for either side to pretend the competing rights dont exist.

 

[therealjohnny]

That's the most stupid argument I ever heard.
What the fuck have souls got to do with anything
Are you all going to start eating meat because animals dont have souls?
WTF!

haha- taken out of context , yes it seems ridiculous

But W. was comparing Janers stance to that of the hard-line Christian/anti abortion crowd and so asked if (Janer) had a religious or spiritual reason behind his views, hence the whole soul thing