Self-improvement, philosophy, self-help etc (2 Viewers)

[egg_]

I don't think needs are in a hierarchy. Obvs if you don't get your physical needs met you die, but not getting your emotional needs met can kill you too, just less directly. And I think self actualisation is a fantasy

 

[ann post]

I don't think needs are in a hierarchy. Obvs if you don't get your physical needs met you die, but not getting your emotional needs met can kill you too, just less directly. And I think self actualisation is a fantasy

Why have you arranged them in a hierarchy then?

 

[magicbastarder]

I apologise for the colour scheme of this post.

 

[magicbastarder]

Anyway, on topic, I've mentioned elsewhere that I've been bingeing on the blindboy podcast while I've been painting the house, and thus have been more exposed to 'therapy speak' than I have ever been. A lot of that is not for me, I've thankfully not had to deal with a lot of what he addresses in his mental health episodes. But would wonder where people would draw the line between that, and the basic concepts being discussed above, and 'self help' books?

I know someone who reads a lot of self help/improve your life books, and they're really quite selfish and mercenary. That sort of 'i want to discuss my problems with you' person, who will say 'can we talk about something happier?' if someone else tries to discuss their problems with them.
Whether the self help books caused them to behave like that, or they were already like that, I don't know, but I know which answer I'd guess. But I do suspect reading lots of books which make you ponder your inner workings can make you focus too much on your inner workings.

 

[ann post]

On the topic of religion being inevitable i kinda see stuff like blindboy essentially being modern day mass.
There's digital community there who all go listen to the same lad shite on every week and if you say anything bad about mental health then you'll have to say a few rosaries or something.

He has seeked out the role in society where he wears a mask as a safety net for his own personality - not much different to firing on a big robe every sunday morning when you have to speak about the matters of the community...

I've actually never listened to the podcast.

 

[Deadmanposting]

Anyway, on topic, I've mentioned elsewhere that I've been bingeing on the blindboy podcast while I've been painting the house, and thus have been more exposed to 'therapy speak' than I have ever been. A lot of that is not for me, I've thankfully not had to deal with a lot of what he addresses in his mental health episodes. But would wonder where people would draw the line between that, and the basic concepts being discussed above, and 'self help' books?

I know someone who reads a lot of self help/improve your life books, and they're really quite selfish and mercenary. That sort of 'i want to discuss my problems with you' person, who will say 'can we talk about something happier?' if someone else tries to discuss their problems with them.
Whether the self help books caused them to behave like that, or they were already like that, I don't know, but I know which answer I'd guess. But I do suspect reading lots of books which make you ponder your inner workings can make you focus too much on your inner workings.

Everyone's got their own level of needs.
I think there's real value in reading what thoughtful people have written about dealing with life. When you have a decent understanding of yourself and your needs, you can recognise what's useful to you and what you can leave; the old "take what you like, and leave the rest".

Endlessly reading every guru to come down the pike in the hope that there's an answer for you somewhere sounds like a massive task.

Your friend is in pain, it sounds like to me. Or they're perhaps a narcissist. Or both. Or not at all. Not sure books cause any of that though. But again, maybe so, maybe not.

 

[ernesto]

Anyway, on topic, I've mentioned elsewhere that I've been bingeing on the blindboy podcast while I've been painting the house, and thus have been more exposed to 'therapy speak' than I have ever been. A lot of that is not for me, I've thankfully not had to deal with a lot of what he addresses in his mental health episodes. But would wonder where people would draw the line between that, and the basic concepts being discussed above, and 'self help' books?

I know someone who reads a lot of self help/improve your life books, and they're really quite selfish and mercenary. That sort of 'i want to discuss my problems with you' person, who will say 'can we talk about something happier?' if someone else tries to discuss their problems with them.
Whether the self help books caused them to behave like that, or they were already like that, I don't know, but I know which answer I'd guess. But I do suspect reading lots of books which make you ponder your inner workings can make you focus too much on your inner workings.

I tend to skip those mental health heavy episodes. Or least give them a spin before sometimes going nah, not learning anything new here and it's just boring.

 

[magicbastarder]

Everyone's got their own level of needs.
I think there's real value in reading what thoughtful people have written about dealing with life. When you have a decent understanding of yourself and your needs, you can recognise what's useful to you and what you can leave; the old "take what you like, and leave the rest".

Endlessly reading every guru to come down the pike in the hope that there's an answer for you somewhere sounds like a massive task.

Your friend is in pain, it sounds like to me. Or they're perhaps a narcissist. Or both. Or not at all. Not sure books cause any of that though. But again, maybe so, maybe not.

I suspect the main issue many people have with self help books is that the assumption is a lot of them are focused on making you feel better about yourself - which is not a bad thing in itself - but what many people need is a kick up the hole, not a 'you're a rare and precious flower' message.
The latter message probably sells better

 

[magicbastarder]

On the topic of religion being inevitable i kinda see stuff like blindboy essentially being modern day mass.
There's digital community there who all go listen to the same lad shite on every week and if you say anything bad about mental health then you'll have to say a few rosaries or something.

He has seeked out the role in society where he wears a mask as a safety net for his own personality - not much different to firing on a big robe every sunday morning when you have to speak about the matters of the community...

I've actually never listened to the podcast.

He uses the word 'cunt' more often than most priests would.

 

[Aiona]

When I was having a lot of really bad relationships, a good friend (now deceased) recommended _Nice Guys Don't Get Laid_ by Marcus P. Meleton. I really enjoyed it. I don't know how good it is as a self-help book, but after I took the lessons to heart, I finally stopped dating losers. Married for 22 years. I give a copy to all my girlfriends who are having dating problems.

 

[seanc]

I don't think needs are in a hierarchy. Obvs if you don't get your physical needs met you die, but not getting your emotional needs met can kill you too, just less directly. And I think self actualisation is a fantasy

Maslow's hierarchy of needs isn't designed for the likes of you. You're living the dream.

It's for middle managers of middling intelligence.

And iirc, it was on page nine or ten of the Junior Cert business studies text book. It's a good starting point but it's not advanced or whatever.


That said, Ann has changed it around a bit and made it his own. Fair play.

 

[ann post]

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dude in mask talks mental health

 

[egg_]

When I was having a lot of really bad relationships, a good friend (now deceased) recommended _Nice Guys Don't Get Laid_ by Marcus P. Meleton. I really enjoyed it. I don't know how good it is as a self-help book, but after I took the lessons to heart, I finally stopped dating losers. Married for 22 years. I give a copy to all my girlfriends who are having dating problems.

Your girlfriends? Are you a woman? And you changed your dating patterns after reading a self-help book aimed at men? Tell me more ...

 

[ann post]

It's for middle managers of middling intelligence.

I don't really buy that. Like the dude who did the instructional with us was 100% outward and committed socialist. It's like saying bikes are for middle managment, yes they are, but they are also for all the rest of the humans.

 

[nuke terrorist]

Your girlfriends? Are you a woman? And you changed your dating patterns after reading a self-help book aimed at men? Tell me more ...

Sounds more humour than self help

Nice Guys Don't Get Laid

A tongue-in-cheek synopsis of the dating scene - one ma…

www.goodreads.com

I was hoping it was more about people who have a 'let's just be friends' attitude.

 

[Deadmanposting]

I suspect the main issue many people have with self help books is that the assumption is a lot of them are focused on making you feel better about yourself - which is not a bad thing in itself - but what many people need is a kick up the hole, not a 'you're a rare and precious flower' message.
The latter message probably sells better

In my somewhat limited experience, they come in all flavours, from Chicken Soup For the Soul to David Goggins: Can't Hurt Me. THere's plenty of books/programmes willing to call you a pussy if that's what works for you.
Maybe self-help has a bad name? Maybe growth is better? Or adding skills?
I dunno.
I don't think there's one thing for everyone. When something captures your imagination, that's not a difficult thing to recognise.


I think people in Ireland and the UK have a problem with the very idea of people trying. Like it's some attempt to be better than them or it's got notions. I see that less with the Germans, Italians and Spanish that I know.
They are better cheerleaders for each other, in my anecdotal experience.
Can't back any of that up with anything other than a feeling.

 

[Aiona]

Your girlfriends? Are you a woman? And you changed your dating patterns after reading a self-help book aimed at men? Tell me more ...

Yup. I identify as female. LOL! And yes. It was a very eye-opening book. You can "Read Sample" on Amazon. I know it's not for everyone. One of my girlfriends didn't like the book. She is still dating losers. (and actually we're not friends anymore.... her life has taken a very different trajectory than mine)

 

[Cormcolash]

So ask thumped basically??

Show them this thread

 

[Unicron]

I know someone who reads a lot of self help/improve your life books, and they're really quite selfish and mercenary. That sort of 'i want to discuss my problems with you' person, who will say 'can we talk about something happier?' if someone else tries to discuss their problems with them.
Whether the self help books caused them to behave like that, or they were already like that, I don't know, but I know which answer I'd guess. But I do suspect reading lots of books which make you ponder your inner workings can make you focus too much on your inner workings.

There was a piece that went semi-viral last year on the topic of "has therapy speak made people worse."

Actually, I found it Is Therapy-Speak Making Us Selfish?

A lot of people seem to use it as an excuse not to engage in helping their friends. A high brow version of "Oh I hate talking to XYZ, they're such a downer."

There is some value in establishing boundaries, I've a big people pleasing element and some people are good at spotting and exploiting these sorts of people so eventually I had to stop making myself available to a couple friends and cut them out of my life for my own good. I don't think friendships should be transactional and part of friendship is stepping up when someone needs you but when it's all take take take it can wear you out.

 

[magicbastarder]

i remember when my uncle went to AA years ago y mum commented that going through that process makes you selfish. hard to tell; he's an angry, bitter asshole anyway.