Iraq (6 Viewers)

lets not forget who we are dealing with here..he is the US puppy who has done these kinds of things..

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/07/16/1089694568757.html?oneclick=true

Allawi shot prisoners in cold blood: witnesses
By Paul McGeough in Baghdad
July 17, 2004




Iyad Allawi, the new Prime Minister of Iraq, pulled a pistol and executed as many as six suspected insurgents at a Baghdad police station, just days before Washington handed control of the country to his interim government, according to two people who allege they witnessed the killings.

They say the prisoners - handcuffed and blindfolded - were lined up against a wall in a courtyard adjacent to the maximum-security cell block in which they were held at the Al-Amariyah security centre, in the city's south-western suburbs.

They say Dr Allawi told onlookers the victims had each killed as many as 50 Iraqis and they "deserved worse than death".

The Prime Minister's office has denied the entirety of the witness accounts in a written statement to the Herald, saying Dr Allawi had never visited the centre and he did not carry a gun.

But the informants told the Herald that Dr Allawi shot each young man in the head as about a dozen Iraqi policemen and four Americans from the Prime Minister's personal security team watched in stunned silence.


Iraq's Interior Minister, Falah al-Naqib, is said to have looked on and congratulated him when the job was done. Mr al-Naqib's office has issued a verbal denial.

The names of three of the alleged victims have been obtained by the Herald.

One of the witnesses claimed that before killing the prisoners Dr Allawi had told those around him that he wanted to send a clear message to the police on how to deal with insurgents.

"The prisoners were against the wall and we were standing in the courtyard when the Interior Minister said that he would like to kill them all on the spot. Allawi said that they deserved worse than death - but then he pulled the pistol from his belt and started shooting them."

Re-enacting the killings, one witness stood three to four metres in front of a wall and swung his outstretched arm in an even arc, left to right, jerking his wrist to mimic the recoil as each bullet was fired. Then he raised a hand to his brow, saying: "He was very close. Each was shot in the head."

The prisoners were against the wall and we were standing in the courtyard when the Interior Minister said that he would like to kill them all on the spot. Allawi said that they deserved worse than death - but then he pulled the pistol from his belt and started shooting them.The witnesses said seven prisoners had been brought out to the courtyard, but the last man in the line was only wounded - in the neck, said one witness; in the chest, said the other.

Given Dr Allawi's role as the leader of the US experiment in planting a model democracy in the Middle East, allegations of a return to the cold-blooded tactics of his predecessor are likely to stir a simmering debate on how well Washington knows its man in Baghdad, and precisely what he envisages for the new Iraq.

There is much debate and rumour in Baghdad about the Prime Minister's capacity for brutality, but this is the first time eyewitness accounts have been obtained.

A former CIA officer, Vincent Cannisatraro, recently told The New Yorker: "If you're asking me if Allawi has blood on his hands from his days in London, the answer is yes, he does. He was a paid Mukhabarat [intelligence] agent for the Iraqis, and he was involved in dirty stuff."

In Baghdad, varying accounts of the shootings are interpreted by observers as useful to a little-known politician who, after 33 years in exile, needs to prove his leadership credentials as a "strongman" in a war-ravaged country that has no experience of democracy.

Dr Allawi's statement dismissed the allegations as rumours instigated by enemies of his interim government.

But in a sharp reminder of the Iraqi hunger for security above all else, the witnesses did not perceive themselves as whistle-blowers. In interviews with the Herald they were enthusiastic about such killings, with one of them arguing: "These criminals were terrorists. They are the ones who plant the bombs."

Before the shootings, the 58-year-old Prime Minister is said to have told the policemen they must have courage in their work and that he would shield them from any repercussions if they killed insurgents in the course of their duty.

The witnesses said the Iraqi police observers were "shocked and surprised". But asked what message they might take from such an act, one said: "Any terrorists in Iraq should have the same destiny. This is the new Iraq.

"Allawi wanted to send a message to his policemen and soldiers not to be scared if they kill anyone - especially, they are not to worry about tribal revenge. He said there would be an order from him and the Interior Ministry that all would be fully protected.

"He told them: 'We must destroy anyone who wants to destroy Iraq and kill our people.'

"At first they were surprised. I was scared - but now the police seem to be very happy about this. There was no anger at all, because so many policemen have been killed by these criminals."

Dr Allawi had made a surprise visit to the complex, they said.
 
I need to be optimistic of the future in Iraq but this was not a good time to run an election - i mirrors the condition of the occupation. While I am happy that approximately 8 million people voted as it represents just 32% of the population across a wide range of candidates it will be hard to forge legitimacy. And it is a pity that their first taste of 'democracy' in decades is experienced in a climate of fear.
 
So, within Iraq, voters were registered according to a programme initiated in 1996 and which has been defunct for 2 years and given the subsequent dislocation of Iraqi society this should still capture most adults, but not as many as claimed.

Still doesn't explain the exile issue and the claims made for that.

As to the legitimacy of the election, something I wasn't actually questioning, that is in real doubt. The voter roll, the part played by US troops, the absence of international observers, absence of candidate and party information all mean that there is serious doubts over it's legitimacy. Quite apart from the fact that it clearly serves US rather than Iraqi interests.

I hope Iraqis did vote in large numbers, despite the illegitimacy of the process, and vote for parties that will make life hard for the occupation.
 
broken arm said:
I need to be optimistic of the future in Iraq but this was not a good time to run an election - i mirrors the condition of the occupation. While I am happy that approximately 8 million people voted as it represents just 32% of the population across a wide range of candidates it will be hard to forge legitimacy. And it is a pity that their first taste of 'democracy' in decades is experienced in a climate of fear.

how many people vote here in Ireland? Isn't it about 50%? Should our elections be declared illegitimate as well?

The fact that so many Iraqis turned up to vote despite the threat of violence shows Iraqis have embraced this election. I don't think it is a pity that these peoples first democratic vote ever was experienced in a climate of fear, I think it is very humbling that people did get out and vote despite the threat of insurgents. fair fucks to them.
 
spiritualtramp said:
how many people vote here in Ireland? Isn't it about 50%? Should our elections be declared illegitimate as well?

Year Total Vote Registration Vote/Reg VAP Vote/VAP Invalid FH Pop. Size 1st

1948 1 336 628 1 800 210 74.2% 1 820 850 73.4% 1.0% - 2 985 000 41.9%
1951 1 343 616 1 785 144 75.3% 1 806 210 74.4% 0.9% - 2 961 000 46.3%
1954 1 347 932 1 763 209 76.4% 1 789 130 75.3% 0.9% - 2 933 000 43.4%
1957 1 238 559 1 738 278 71.3% 1 759 850 70.4% 0.9% - 2 885 000 48.3%
1961 1 179 738 1 670 860 70.6% 1 662 620 71.0% 1.0% - 2 818 000 43.8%
1965 1 264 666 1 683 019 75.1% 1 699 200 74.4% 0.9% - 2 880 000 47.7%
1969 1 334 963 1 735 388 76.9% 1 728 700 77.2% 1.2% - 2 930 000 45.7%
1973 1 366 474 1 783 604 76.6% 1 757 400 77.8% 1.2% 3 3 030 000 46.2%
1977 1 616 770 2 118 606 76.3% 1 898 340 85.2% 0.9% 2 3 273 000 50.6%
1981 1 734 379 2 275 450 76.2% 2 201 600 78.8% 0.9% 2 3 440 000 45.3%
1982 1 701 385 2 335 153 72.9% 2 229 120 76.3% 0.7% 2 3 483 000 45.2%
1987 1 793 406 2 445 515 73.3% 2 302 950 77.9% 0.9% 2 3 543 000 44.1%
1989 1 677 592 2 448 810 68.5% 2 355 050 71.2% 1.2% 2 3 515 000 44.2%
1992 1 751 351 2 557 036 68.5% 2 377 830 73.7% 1.5% 2 3 549 000 39.1%
1997 1 788 997 2 707 498 66.1% 2 681 821 66.7% 0.6% 2 3 807 391 39.3%
 
spiritualtramp said:
how many people vote here in Ireland? Isn't it about 50%? Should our elections be declared illegitimate as well?

that's not quite what I was saying. The spread over (mostly unknown) candidates will make legitimacy of power in the current climate difficult. As long as the authority becomes as representative as possible then we may see some stemming of the violence and civil/tribal tensions. I welcome the vote but recognise it's difficulties especially under occupation. It won't strike me as a successful election in the same way the first free election of East Timor etc. but i don't doubt that the future will get better
 
broken arm said:
that's not quite what I was saying. The spread over (mostly unknown) candidates will make legitimacy of power in the current climate difficult.

right so. I get what you were saying now.;)


broken arm said:
As long as the authority becomes as representative as possible then we may see some stemming of the violence and civil/tribal tensions. I welcome the vote but recognise it's difficulties especially under occupation. It won't strike me as a successful election in the same way the first free election of East Timor etc. but i don't doubt that the future will get better

I reckon Iraq will eventually be split in three - a kurdish state, a sunni state and a shia one. No doubt there will be some civil war along the way.
 
ELEVEN DIE IN IRAQ BOMB


Eleven police officers have been killed in a bomb explosion in the Iraqi Sunni city of Mosul.


The authorities said the officers were queueing to receive their monthly pay.

The blast took place near the city's main hospital.

"Eleven police were killed and six others wounded in the explosion," said police captain Kassem Mohammad.

"They were gathered to receive their pay near the hospital."

The northern city is considered a stronghold for Sunni insurgents.

:: A car bomb exploded outside the police headquarters in the town of Baquba, north of Baghdad, causing an unknown number of casualties, police said.
 
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/A22F76E8-A560-49D3-BBF3-38DE820B06BB.htm

US army to revoke "hastily" given purple heart medals.

quick version.

Go and fight in Iraq.
Ok.
get crushed by one of our own tanks and get a broken pelvis and shredded internal organs.
Ok so.
We'll give you a medal, won't that be nice? shows how brave you were!
great!
OOps sorry we have to take the medal back because you were wounded by our side and not the enemy.
D'oh.
 
pretty much sums it up for me. All the talk of "freedom" and "democracy". Wont add up to a hill of beans for the average Iraqi.Brilliant article.

Sorry George, but Iraq has given you the purple finger

The party likely to win the election opposes the US presence and policies

Naomi Klein
Saturday February 12, 2005
The Guardian

'The Iraqi people gave America the biggest thank you in the best way we could have hoped for." Reading this election analysis from Betsy Hart, a columnist for the Scripps Howard News Service, I found myself thinking about my late grandmother.
Half blind and a menace behind the wheel of her Chevrolet, she adamantly refused to surrender her car keys. She was convinced that everywhere she drove (flattening the house pets of Philadelphia along the way), people were waving and smiling at her. "They are so friendly!" We had to break the bad news. "They aren't waving with their whole hand, grandma - just with their middle finger."

So it is with Betsy Hart and the other near-sighted election observers. They think the Iraqi people have finally sent America those long-awaited flowers and sweets, when Iraq's voters just gave them the (purple) finger. Judging by the millions of votes already counted, Iraqis have voted overwhelmingly to throw out the US-installed Ayad Allawi, who refused to ask the United States to leave. A decisive majority voted for the United Iraqi Alliance (UIA); the second plank in the UIA platform called for "a timetable for the withdrawal of the multinational forces from Iraq".

There are more single-digit messages embedded in the winning coalition's platform. Some highlights: "Adopting a social security system under which the state guarantees a job for every fit Iraqi ... and offers facilities to citizens to build homes"; the alliance also pledges "to write off Iraq's debts, cancel reparations and use the oil wealth for economic development projects". In short, Iraqis voted to repudiate the radical free-market policies imposed by the former chief American envoy Paul Bremer and locked in by a recent agreement with the International Monetary Fund.

So will the people who got all choked up watching Iraqis flock to the polls support these democratically chosen demands? Please. "You don't set timetables," George Bush said four days after the Iraqis voted for exactly that. Likewise, Tony Blair called the elections "magnificent" but dismissed a firm timetable out of hand. The UIA's pledges to expand the public sector, keep the oil and drop the debt will likely suffer similar fates. At least if Adel Abd al-Mahdi gets his way - he's Iraq's finance minister and the man suddenly being touted as the leader of Iraq's next government.

Al-Mahdi is the Bush administration's Trojan horse in the UIA. (You didn't think they were going to put all their money on Allawi, did you?) In October, he told a gathering of the American Enterprise Institute that he planned to "restructure and privatise [Iraq's] state-owned enterprises", and in December he made another trip to Washington to unveil plans for a new oil law, "very promising to the American investors". It was al-Mahdi himself who oversaw the signing of a flurry of deals with Shell, BP and ChevronTexaco in the weeks before the elections, and it is he who negotiated the recent austerity deal with the IMF.

On troop withdrawal, al-Mahdi sounds nothing like his party's platform, and instead appears to be echoing Dick Cheney on Fox News: "When the Americans go will depend on when our own forces are ready and on how the resistance responds after the elections." But on Sharia law, we are told, he is very close to the clerics.

Iraq's elections were delayed time and time again while the occupation and resistance grew ever more deadly. Now it seems that two years of bloodshed, bribery and backroom arm-twisting were leading up to this: a deal in which the ayatollahs get control over the family, Texaco gets the oil, and Washington gets its enduring military bases (call it the "oil-for-women programme"). Everyone wins except the voters, who risked their lives to cast their ballots for very different policies.

But never mind that. January 30, we are told, was not about what Iraqis were voting for; it was about the fact of their voting and, more important, how their plucky courage made Americans feel about their war. Apparently, the election's true purpose was to prove to Americans that, as George Bush put it, "the Iraqi people value their own liberty". Stunningly, this appears to come as news. The Chicago Sun-Times columnist Mark Brown said the vote was "the first clear sign that freedom really may mean something to the Iraqi people". On The Daily Show, CNN's Anderson Cooper described it as "the first time we've sort of had a gauge of whether or not they're willing to sort of step forward and do stuff".

This is some tough crowd. The Shia uprising against Saddam in 1991 was clearly not enough to convince them that Iraqis were willing to "do stuff" to be free. Neither was the demonstration of 100,000 people held one year ago demanding immediate elections, nor the spontaneous local elections organised by Iraqis in the early months of the occupation - both summarily shot down by Bremer. It turns out that on American television, the entire occupation has been one long episode of the reality TV show Fear Factor, in which Iraqis overcome ever more challenging obstacles to demonstrate the depths of their desire to win their country back. Having their cities levelled, being tortured in Abu Ghraib, getting shot at checkpoints, having their journalists censored and their water and electricity cut off - all of it was just a prelude to the ultimate endurance test: dodging bombs and bullets to get to the polling station. At last, Americans were persuaded that Iraqis really, really wanted to be free.

So what's the prize? An end to occupation, as the voters demanded? Don't be silly, the US government won't submit to any "artificial timetable". Jobs for everyone, as the UIA promised? You can't vote for socialist nonsense like that. No, they get Geraldo Rivera's tears ("I felt like such a sap"); Laura Bush's motherly pride ("It was so moving for the president and me to watch people come out with purple fingers"); and Betsy Hart's sincere apology for ever doubting them ("Wow - do I stand corrected").

And that should be enough. Because if it weren't for the invasion, Iraqis would not even have the freedom to vote for their liberation, and then to have that vote completely ignored. And that's the real prize: the freedom to be occupied. Wow - do I stand corrected.
 
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