Iraq (4 Viewers)

[pete]

A soldier with the 1st Battalion, 5th Infantry Stryker Brigade Combat Team of the 25th Infantry Division approaches the car with the bloody body of a man in it.
(GETTY IMAGES PHOTO/CHRIS HONDROS)

A boy, one of the dead couple's children, who suffered a nonlife-threatening flesh wound, is taken to the hospital. None of the four other children was injured.
(GETTY IMAGES PHOTO/CHRIS HONDROS)

A girl, one of the dead couple's children, sits at the feet of soldiers with the 1st Battalion, 5th Infantry Stryker Brigade Combat Team of the 25th Infantry Division after their car was fired on.
(GETTY IMAGES PHOTO/CHRIS HONDROS)

Soldiers with the 1st Battalion, 5th Infantry Stryker Brigade Combat Team of the 25th Infantry Division hold two children who survived when their parents' car was fired on .
(GETTY IMAGES PHOTO/CHRIS HONDROS)

A blood-covered girl screams after her parents were fatally shot by soldiers with the 1st Battalion, 5th Infantry Stryker Brigade Combat Team of the 25th Infantry Division after the family failed to stop driving their car. The girl was uninjured.
(GETTY IMAGES PHOTO/CHRIS HONDROS)

The following is an account by Getty Images photographer Chris Hondros from Tal Afar, Iraq, about 40 miles west of Mosul. A U.S. military statement released after the incident said "military officials extend their condolences for this unfortunate incident," according to the Associated Press. The military said that, so far this year, at least five suicide car bombers have struck Iraqi security troops and U.S. military patrols at checkpoints in the area.

A routine foot patrol -- a dozen or so men from a platoon, carefully walking the dusky streets of Tal Afar just after sundown.

Usually little more happens than finding someone out after curfew, patting him down and then sending him home. On daylight patrols, sometimes, troops stop to briefly play with children or even drink tea. On evening patrols -- past curfew -- no one is on the streets, and the men are extra-vigilant and professional.

Tal Afar is an ethnically mixed town, though primarily Turkoman, and had only days before been the scene of a gun battle between U.S. forces and local insurgents.

On the evening of Jan. 18, as we made our way up a broad boulevard, in the distance I could see car making its way toward us. As a defense against potential car-bombs, it is now standard practice for foot patrols to stop oncoming vehicles, particularly after dark.

"We have a car coming," someone called out as we entered an intersection. We could see the car about a 100 meters away. The car continued coming; I couldn't see it anymore from my perch but could hear its engine now, a high whine that sounded more like acceleration than slowing down. It was maybe 50 yards away now.

"Stop that car!" someone shouted out, seemingly simultaneously with someone firing what sounded like warning shots -- a staccato, measured burst. The car continued coming. And then, perhaps less than a second later, a cacophony of fire, shots rattling off in a chaotic, overlapping din. The car entered the intersection on its momentum and still shots were penetrating it and slicing it. Finally, the shooting stopped, the car drifted listlessly, clearly no longer being steered, and came to a rest on a curb. Soldiers began to approach it warily.

The sound of children crying came from the car. I walked up to the car and a teenaged girl with her head covered emerged from the back, wailing and gesturing wildly. After her came a boy, tumbling onto the ground from the seat, already leaving a pool of blood.

"Civilians!" someone shouted, and soldiers ran up. More children -- it ended up being six all told -- started emerging, crying, their faces mottled with blood in long streaks. The troops carried them all off to a nearby sidewalk.

It was by now almost completely dark. There, working only by lights mounted on ends of their rifles, an Army medic began assessing the children's injuries, running his hands up and down their bodies, looking for wounds. Incredibly, the only injuries were a girl with a cut hand and a boy with a superficial gash in the small of his back that was bleeding heavily but wasn't life-threatening. The medic immediately began to bind it, while the boy crouched against a wall.

From the sidewalk I could see into the bullet-mottled windshield more clearly. The driver of the car, a man, was penetrated by so many bullets that his skull had collapsed, leaving his body grotesquely disfigured. A woman also lay dead in the front, still covered in her Muslim clothing and harder to see.

Meanwhile, the children continued to wail and scream, huddled against a wall, sandwiched between soldiers either binding their wounds or trying to comfort them. The Army's translator later told me that this was a Turkoman family and that the teenaged girl kept shouting, "Why did they shoot us? We have no weapons! We were just going home!"

There was a small delay in getting the armored vehicles lined up and ready, and soon the convoy moved to the main Tal Afar hospital. It was fairly large and surprisingly well outfitted, with sober-looking doctors in white coats ambling about its sea-green halls. The young children were carried in by soldiers and by their teenaged sister. Only the boy with the gash on his back needed any further medical attention, and the Army medic and an Iraqi doctor quickly chatted over his prognosis, deciding that his wound would be easily repaired.

The Army told me it will probably launch a full investigation.
Copyright © 2005, Newsday, Inc.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/ny-wocheck0120,0,532599.story?coll=ny-world-big-pix

 

[Goff]

Re those pictures....

I've said it before and I'll say it again.

CUNTS.

 

[aoboa]

How come there are no reports on this on BBC or the Guardian?

 

[aoboa]

Whoops... just found it on bbc

 

[Latex lizzie]

..although brilliant, the guardian can be awful slow to report stuff sometimes. They are usually a day short on breaking news..

 

[snakybus]

Re: Iraq - illegal? yes, says a neocon

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1089158,00.html

Richard Perle makes a boo boo, just watch as the White House distances itself from this

 

[pete]

"Stop that car!" someone shouted out, seemingly simultaneously with someone firing what sounded like warning shots -- a staccato, measured burst. The car continued coming. And then, perhaps less than a second later, a cacophony of fire, shots rattling off in a chaotic, overlapping din.

Bear that in mind when people say "But they didn't stop for warning shots".


http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/search/FrameSet.aspx?s=EventImagesSearchState|1|0|30|0|0|1|0|0|0|52007332|0|0|0|0|0||0|0|0|0&p=1

 

[pete]

Abd El-Rahman Al-Zobari, surveying the damage to his house, said he and his friends are not going to vote on Sunday. "Is this what they call democracy?" he said. "We don't want democracy that comes on the back of a tank."

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/01/24/falluja.conditions/index.html

 

[Latex lizzie]

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13289603,00.html

Iraqi security forces are torturing and abusing detainees, a human rights group has claimed.

Some 72 of 90 Iraqi detainees interviewed claim to have been tortured or ill-treated, Human Rights Watch said.


And the Iraqi authorities along with international police advisers are turning a blind eye to the abuse, the organisation said.

New York-based executive director Sarah Leah Whitson claimed the abuses were being allowed to go unchecked in attempts to bring stability to Iraq.

"The people of Iraq were promised something better than this after the government of Saddam Hussein fell," she said.

 

[Latex lizzie]

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/6DBEFF24-C67A-448E-B317-AD6E41C2E879.htm

Armed men have shot and killed an Iraqi judge as he was leaving his home in eastern Baghdad, police sources say, while six US soldiers have died in separate incidents.

 

[Latex lizzie]

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13290349,00.html

could it be the begining of the end of the occupation? and the start of the long awaited(feared) civil war?

 

[tomahawk]

"As part of sweeping 'economic restructuring' implemented by the Bush Administration in Iraq, Iraqi farmers will no longer be permitted to save their seeds, which include seeds the Iraqis themselves have developed over hundreds of years. Instead, they will be forced to buy seeds from US corporations. That is because in recent years, transnational corporations have patented and now own many seed varieties originated or developed by indigenous peoples. In a short time, Iraq will be living under the new American credo: Pay Monsanto or starve."

Read more here

 

[broken arm]

"As part of sweeping 'economic restructuring' implemented by the Bush Administration in Iraq, Iraqi farmers will no longer be permitted to save their seeds, which include seeds the Iraqis themselves have developed over hundreds of years. Instead, they will be forced to buy seeds from US corporations. That is because in recent years, transnational corporations have patented and now own many seed varieties originated or developed by indigenous peoples. In a short time, Iraq will be living under the new American credo: Pay Monsanto or starve."

Read more here

shocking.

 

[Latex lizzie]

..how would this kinda thing be enforced? seems like something the US would do..I dont doubt they would try, but I doubt it would fly. Is there any precedent that is similar to this taking hold ? I know there were some companies in africa who got women to replace breast milk with artificial stuff but that was a company not a government. Whats the pitch to the farmers why would they bother applying for a licence? what are the reprocussions if you dont have one? Just wondering.

 

[spiritualtramp]

As cynical as I was about the invasion of Iraq and this election, I do think it is pretty cool that people have been able to vote in Iraq.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4220551.stm

 

[Latex lizzie]

democracy at a price.

BBC obtains Iraq casualty figures
Panorama: Exit strategy
BBC One, Sunday, 30 January 2005 at 22:15 GMT

Coalition troops and Iraqi security forces may be responsible for up to 60% of conflict-related civilian deaths in Iraq - far more than are killed by insurgents, confidential records obtained by the BBC's Panorama programme reveal.

Official figures, compiled by Iraq's Ministry of Health, break down deaths according to insurgent and coalition activity. They are usually available only to Iraqi cabinet ministers.

The data covers the period 1 July 2004 to 1 January 2005, and relates to all conflict-related civilian deaths and injuries recorded by Iraqi public hospitals. The figures exclude, where known, the deaths of insurgents.


Conflct-related civilian deaths in Iraq. July 2004 to January 2005
3,274 civilians killed in total
2,041 by coalition and Iraqi security forces
1,233 by insurgents
12,657 civilians wounded in total
8,542 by coalition and Iraqi security forces
4,115 by insurgents

The figures reveal that 3,274 Iraqi civilians were killed and 12,657 wounded in conflict-related violence during the period.

Of those deaths, 60% - 2,041 civilians - were killed by the coalition and Iraqi security forces. A further 8,542 were wounded by them.

Insurgent attacks claimed 1,233 lives, and wounded 4,115 people, during the same period.

Panorama interviewed US Ambassador John Negroponte shortly before it obtained the figures. He told reporter John Simpson:

"My impression is that the largest amount of civilian casualties definitely is a result of these indiscriminate car bombings.

"You yourself are aware of those as they occur in the Baghdad area and more frequently than not the largest number of victims of these acts of terror are innocent civilian bystanders".

The coalition has yet to respond to the figures.

Panorama's film Exit Strategy, reported by BBC world affairs editor John Simpson from Baghdad, will be shown at 2215 GMT, Sunday night on BBC One.


Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/programmes/panorama/4217413.stm

 

[Latex lizzie]

"Having spent most of my adult life either on or near military posts, married to a woman who teaches in the schools, you often hear the sounds of tank firing. You often hear the sounds of artillery rounds going off. And she seems to be quite capable of calming the children and letting them understand that those booms and those bangs that they hear are simply the sounds of freedom." US General Kimmit

sham election: http://talk.guardian.co.uk/[email protected]@.7747a740

 

[spiritualtramp]

sham election: http://talk.guardian.co.uk/[email protected]@.7747a740

I don't think it was a total sham. If it was a sham people would not have bothered voting. Whilst I disagree strongly with the many insensitive actions of US troops in Iraq I for one was pretty happy to actually see people vote in Iraq. Democracy is good.

 

[Latex lizzie]

Wait to see the results, and the way in which the country goes post election before I would go that far myself. Democracy enforced with curfews and shoot to kill policy, I never was that hot on.Well see. I hope it works out. Free reign for the the current US admin to go mad in the region if it does.

 

[spiritualtramp]

Wait to see the results, and the way in which the country goes post election before I would go that far myself. Democracy enforced with curfews and shoot to kill policy, I never was that hot on.Well see. I hope it works out. Free reign for the the current US admin to go mad in the region if it does.

I suspect Allawi is more than likely going to win as they had bloody millions of candidates to vote for which most people never heard of before. I don't like Allawi but fuck it, at least there was a vote instead of some prick dictator. It will take years and years for Iraq to be properly democratic but this is a step in the right direction.

And if the kurds get their own state out of this that will rock.