Violence at Dublin protest (1 Viewer)

[pad]

i notice that most of the comments stating that more force should have been used originate outside of ireland.

 

[Cormo]

Re: protestors.

The whole armband thing has been, and is sometimes done. In Genoa, the whole protest was split into 7 distinct groups, some completely non-violent, some into mild direct action, some into cracking pig skulls, all divided by colours, stewards, etc.

I don't think this is the issue here. There was little or no provocation from the protestors on Monday, whereas the pigs were quite provocative the whole day through, ranging from poe-faced detached arrogance and refusal to interact with or explain themselves to people, to stomping all over flowers left on the road, driving into people, pushing them 'round, taking cameras, arresting and beating those who questioned or filmed them, and simply kicking the fuck out of anyone who got in their way. The most provocative behaviour from the protestors was in the form of shouts of "pigs!", "cunts!", etc at them as they arrested people or interevened, and dancing on the car pushed into the middle of the road (for the purpose of the protest, by it's owner). Admitedly, there was a certain yobbish element, it mainly being that dickhead drunken english crusty bitch in the leather jacket who went around all day trying to tell everyone what to do and later hitting some kid in the face with a buckfast bottle while attempting to throw it at the pigs, and later on by random up-the-ra type bandwagon jumping cunts keen for a ruck with the filth. Someone also gave out about black-bloc type tactics; I'm not at all against violence towards the police & damaging corporate property, but there's a time and a place, and if it's going to get people who are against or aren't into doing that kind of thing get beaten by the pigs in reaction, then that's certainly not the time and place and I'm very much against it. Otherwise I think that people shouldn't try and take such an authoritarian stance towards it -if you're not into it, keep away from it & disassociate yourself from it.

Eggser, I think you're being unnecessarily negative about the whole thing. I think you painted a much worse picture of the day then it was. There was between 600 & 800 there I'd say, maybe up to or over 1000 at certain points during the day. There were people playing games, skateboarding, playing frisbee, dancing, parents with kids, punk rock cheerleaders, etc. There actually was a sound-system, but it admittedly wasn't good enough and the whole thing would have been waaay better if it had been louder (it was only audible within 20/30 feet of the unit). There was also a samba-type drumming group and trad musicians. I personally had a really great day, even though things could have been better. But remember, this was the first RTS in Dublin, at least in recent years and organised by this bunch of people, and I think it was a pretty great start (aside of course from the police riot). Next time a louder sound system, more games & fun, and a clearer definition of where it ends.

It's discouraging that people who weren't there (and some who were) & seem at least partly into the whole idea are so quick to dismiss it based on mainstream-media reports. There wasn't any of the usual SWP-type political rhetoric and "comrades unite!" type speeches or chanting at all. The whole point was that it WASN'T with a particular political focus or emphasis and was a street party for anyone to come along to and enjoy themselves in the kind of environment that's usually given over to those in transit to & from the 9-to-5. And maybe it doesn't change anything, but it's a way that people who aren't crazy pinko commie revolutionaries can actually see that the media portrayal of people who care about what they think is wrong is rediculous, and show that you don't have to spend money for pre-packaged entertainment, and maybe find out more about the whole thing & the idea behind it and become more involved in issues that trouble them personally. People don't seem to realise that RTS is made up of people into environmental issues, human rights issues, animal rights issues, ant-capitalists, socialists, anarchists, cyclists, general lefty-types, hippies, punks, kids, simply ordinary folk who give a fuck about what's going on & want to have some fun, not some mysterious group with a hidden agenda.

 

[pete]

Garda transferred after protest incidents

May 8, 2002

(20:56) A Garda officer who was involved in the violent incidents in Dublin on Bank Holiday Monday has been transferred to other duties. Earlier, Garda Commissioner Pat Byrne said he had viewed the television footage of the disturbances and was 'concerned' about what he saw.

Commissioner Byrne promised that a thorough and professional investigation would be carried out and that all aspects, both criminal and disciplinary, would be examined.

Taoiseach Bertie Ahern has said he fully shared the concerns voiced by the Minister for Justice, John O'Donoghue, about the handling by Gardaí of the disturbances.

Campaigning in County Laois, Mr Ahern said he had every confidence that the matter would be looked by the Gardaí.

Earlier, Mr O'Donoghue said there would be "consequences" for Gardaí who had gone beyond what he called reasonable force.

He said he did not want to pre-judge what had happened until he received a report into the incident.

Mr O'Donoghue said he would "not necessarily" accept the Gardaí's own version of events. He added that the findings of the report would be made public, as far as legally possible.

He was speaking at the launch of Fianna Fáil’s crime policy during which he claimed that it was the only party that could be trusted on crime.

He repeated the party's pledge to recruit 2,000 extra Gardaí and to establish an independent Garda Inspectorate.

He claimed this Inspectorate would have more power than the Garda Ombudsman proposed by other parties.

Both the Labour Party and the Progressive Democrats have said they favour the appointment of such a Garda Ombudsman. Both parties also said they believed the Gardaí should not be asked to investigate themselves.

 

[pete]

Morning Ireland: Clare Connolly of RTÉ Interactive, who was filming for a documentary on protests, outlines her experience and describes the footage she shot during the protest.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/0508/morningireland/morningireland6b.ram

Morning Ireland: Emmet Bunting, one of those injured in the rioting on Monday night who was seen on RTÉ television bulletins with blood pouring down his face, talks about his ordeal.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2002/0508/morningireland/morningireland6a.ram

 

[Goff]

hmm

 

[nine]

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[figs]

Re: Re: protestors.

Originally posted by Cormo
I'm not at all against violence towards the police......... but there's a time and a place,

In what kind of situations could you justify violence against the police, except maybe defending yourself / your mates from them?

 

[rothko]

from todays Irish Times...

Satirical magazine had urged 'a good riot' on Monday
By Jim Cusack, Security Editor

A Dublin-based satirical magazine last week ran a number of articles apparently exhorting people to riot, loot and cause "chaos" in the city centre at Monday's "Reclaim the Streets" demonstration.

Fourteen people were injured and 24 arrests made when gardaí, using batons, broke up the demonstration on Monday evening.

The Slate magazine ran a number of articles under the index heading: "Mayday Mayhem: Johnny Foreigner has been rioting his hole off for the last few years. May 6th could give Ireland the chance to do likewise."

On the following page an article entitled: "The Joy of Rioting - Reclaim the Streets this Mayday by smashing them up" says: "Most European cities have plenty of nice pedestrianised streets and squares where people can congregate to talk shit, trade homemade jewellery and block their ears to the sound of whingeing buskers. Dublin, however, is a badly designed, traffic-ridden place where you can't step on to a road without being obnoxiously honked at by some truck driver or a flash bitch in her new Toyota.

"This is the kind of situation that can only be sorted out by having a good riot, and with any luck, that's exactly what will happen on Bank Holiday Monday. A group of people called Reclaim the Streets are planning to take over part of the city centre for the purposes of having a party involving "free music, food, repetitive beats" and street football.

"With any luck the Garda response to this alien behaviour will be violent enough to provoke a riot. When English football hooligans started acting up in Lansdowne Road, the Garda method for dealing with it seemed to involve charging wildly in with batons swinging around in a highly inaccurate fashion.

"Throw in a few rabid Alsatians who have been instructed to bite anyone under the age of 30 and (in spite of Irish people being notoriously shit at rioting) there is definitely chaos on the cards this May Day.

"A rather pompous Reclaim the Street statement announces that they are going to 'open a new era of urban design' but this shouldn't deter anyone from taking a rare opportunity to go looting and smashing shit up in Dublin's city centre.

"If you want to have a riot, turn up outside the GPO on 6 May at 2.30 p.m."

Further inside the magazine devotes two pages, again, exhorting people to riot on May 6th. Further articles run under headlines including: "How to smash capitalism", "This Mayday we should follow the example of the rest of the civilised world and go on a destructive rioting spree", "Wreck the gaff" and "Who you'll meet at a riot and what they're like".

One piece criticises groups including the Socialist Workers' Party and says: "In this essential guide, we'll provide Dublin's concerned rioters with all they need to know about the Mayday weekend - how to cause maximum damage, what to wear and who you're likely to run into."

Asked about the articles yesterday, one of The Slate journalists, who wished to remain anonymous, said: "We weren't seriously inciting people to cause harm or damage property but we would be keen to see protests."

Saying the articles were "tongue in cheek", he added: "We did accurately predict" that gardaí would use batons.

 

[Unclealo]

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[Goff]

Re: Re: Re: protestors.

Originally posted by figs


In what kind of situations could you justify violence against the police, except maybe defending yourself / your mates from them?

If they looked at me funny.

No, seriously. I don't condone voilence against the police. I'm not a big fan of theirs, but they are the only thing we have that resembles "keepers of the peace" (though they may not be very good at this). After all, we do need a police force. Especially around my way, which, it has to be said, is a fucking cesspit. It's just a pity we don't have any coppers around my way (hence it becoming a cesspit). No, they're too busy putting them all in areas like O'Connel Street (where we need them as well).

Hmm...sounds to me like we don't have the resources to police this fair nation of ours.

Let's hope Bertie sticks to his pledge and gives us those extra police he keeps harping on about.

Oh but somehow I doubt it.

A bit of community policing wouldn't go amiss.

 

[IvanDrago]

Originally posted by Unclealo
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[Cormo]

Re: protestors.

Originally posted by figs


In what kind of situations could you justify violence against the police, except maybe defending yourself / your mates from them?

Well there you go, when defending yourself/your family/friends against them. When they're upholding an unjust system of government. When they're beating and killing innocent people.