the iRA and the Bank Robbery (1 Viewer)

[Chocohead]

makes it kinda hard to read your posts then since ive no idea if you mean what you say or the opposite.

 

[nlgbbbblth]

so you meant the opposite of what you said. well done.

so I didn't put my point across clearly enough for you - I'll admit that

but now should you know what I'm getting at

 

[Chocohead]

yes - against is what I meant
anti-nationalist, whatever you want to call it.

i can say for a fact, from a lot of personal experience - long before i was even interested in northern politics - that the RUC were very very anti nationalist. Can you say from your personal experience that they arent? I'd like to see how you could say they arent, considering the simple fact they are.

OK, now its the PSNI - all that bantering and all we could change was the fucking badge. the amount of public meetings that went on and fuck all was changed as the unionists found it an affront. the PSNI is the RUC, so I can assume assume they are as anti nationalist as ever

 

[Chocohead]

so I didn't put my point across clearly enough for you - I'll admit that

but now should you know what I'm getting at

you didnt put your point across at all. you made a completely different point, then said 'oh yeah thats what i meant'. thats not the same as saying it yourself, nevermind saying the opposite

 

[nlgbbbblth]

i can say for a fact, from a lot of personal experience - long before i was even interested in northern politics - that the RUC were very very anti nationalist. Can you say from your personal experience that they arent? I'd like to see how you could say they arent, considering the simple fact they are.

have had limited encounters with the police there, none bad -
but just because I have had no bad experience with them does not mean that they are knights in shining armour or whatever.

 

[Chocohead]

well, i have no faith or trust in them and the announcement by orde that in his 'opinion' it was the ira hasnt helped much. nor has the amazing lack of evidence.

tell me, what happened about the so called spy ring from last year? ever get any evidence for that? nope you didnt, but lots of people still believe the IRA actually had a spy ring. why do they believe it? because they are gulible and will believe precisely what they are told.

Again i fully admit i could be completely and utterly wrong, but i suspect we will never, ver get to hear what this all so convincing evidence is. If you have already decided to believe all the things we've been fed so far, then thats your decision. I havent made up my mind yet, and i wont until I find out something at least indicative that either the provos or SF were involved. that evidence isnt there yet, including the latest ex SF councillor saga that is sure to unfold over the next few days. i cant wait to hear what he is next. who bets he'll be a 'senior republican' tomorrow eh?

 

[Chocohead]

i still have to laugh at the PSNI guy interviewed a week or so ago when he was telling about how many suspects they had. when asked did they have naything more solid than suspects - ie no proof, just suspected - he said they'd have to ask good old hugh about that.

says a lot that does.

 

[Chocohead]

i just want to dispell a myth here. shinners arent brainwashed by Sinn Fein. theres no hitler like person telling you what to think at cumann meetings. I naturally think along the same lines as sinn fein, thats why i joined them.

I just had to mention that cus im sure i'll be accused of being a typical brainwashed shinner along the line somewhere

 

[spiritualtramp]

well, i have no faith or trust in them and the announcement by orde that in his 'opinion' it was the ira hasnt helped much. nor has the amazing lack of evidence.

Do you have any faith in Bertie Ahern or Tony Blair ? They also believe it was the IRA.

wrong, but i suspect we will never, ver get to hear what this all so convincing evidence is. If you have already decided to believe all the things we've been fed so far, then thats your decision. I havent made up my mind yet, and i wont until I find out something at least indicative that either the provos or SF were involved. that evidence isnt there yet, including the latest ex SF councillor saga that is sure to unfold over the next few days. i cant wait to hear what he is next. who bets he'll be a 'senior republican' tomorrow eh?

Thing is, I bet if the PSNI and Gardai were sharing all the evidence they have with the general public you would be the first to scream how unfair it is.

Evidence cannot be shown before a trial. The reason these arrests have taken so long is that the Gardai and PSNI wanted to gather enough evidence to make the charges stick.

 

[Chocohead]

I dont distrust bertie, though I dont really trust 'saddam is going to kill us in 15mins' blair - but still they are going on the evidence they received - and the advice they;re received from both the gards and the ruc. like the gards wouldnt try andplant explosives and blame the ira or anything - they're really really trustworthy in this instance, yeah?

i hear this court thing everywhere - if thats true then this is the first case ive ever heard of when they'll give absolutely no, nadda, none whatsoever evidence more then ordres 'opinion'. thats real convincing proof. gawd, how could i not trust the word of the a man who has to sack about half of his men if the peace process actually works.

Roll an the forthcoming court case. I'll probably be 120 by the time it comes around, but hey! its worth the wait. They should have arrested adams and co when they offered since obviously they were involved. i wonder why they didnt? the independant monitoring commission said they done it, and they got their info 'independently' from the guards and the ruc, so obviously they reckon the two boyos were involved.

Again, I just want to see something that will take away this feeling that this whole thing is a nice whitewash to a) reduce the sf vote, b) give the unionists the chance of increasing their vote and decreasing the shinner vote in the UK elections and finally c) because of the above,no-one will stop paisley with his mad expel sinn fein give us back a unionist stormont like before idea. thats a really smart thing to do, and you lot are helping by not needing something to prove the actual claims being made against the provos and sinn fein.

Work away .. let it fester until next autumn when there'll still be no proof, but by gad everyone will have forgotton it all (just like the spy ring) except you'll all be sure sinn fein were up to no good. I find that fucking stupendous, but fuck it! everyone has a right to believe what they wish.

 

[Chocohead]

A.

Do you have any faith in Bertie Ahern or Tony Blair ? They also believe it was the IRA.

B.

Gardai and PSNI wanted to gather enough evidence to make the charges stick.

if A was true, then wouldnt they already have the proof for B?

 

[Chocohead]

tell me, what happened about the so called spy ring from last year? ever get any evidence for that?

i'd love an answer to that

 

[spiritualtramp]

Again, I just want to see something that will take away this feeling that this whole thing is a nice whitewash to a) reduce the sf vote, b) give the unionists the chance of increasing their vote and decreasing the shinner vote in the UK elections and finally c) because of the above,no-one will stop paisley with his mad expel sinn fein give us back a unionist stormont like before idea. thats a really smart thing to do, and you lot are helping by not needing something to prove the actual claims being made against the provos and sinn fein.

It must suit your deluded self to believe that this is a PSNI (note the name) set up rather than admit you were wrong.

Could you please explain why Blair would bother to go along with this "whitewash"? The SF vote is of no interest to him as Labour do not even run for election in the north. Blair does not and never has given unconditional support to the unionists. Blair has been the best Prime Minister for nationalists in Northern Ireland ever.

Maybe Paisley has a point - I'd be feeling pretty uneasy about power sharing with Sinn Fein if the killer of Robert McCartney is anything to go by.

 

[Chocohead]

talk away .. ive explained how i feel. as ive said already, we'll have to wait and see.

what have i been wrong about btw? what are you basing that accusation on? you believe i am deluded? in what way and how do you come to that conclusion? and tell me about the spy ring .. i obviously missed out on the evidence for that one as well. silly deluded me eh?

I'll say it once more .. considering we have nothing but hearsay to go on at present - we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Chocohead]

Maybe Paisley has a point - I'd be feeling pretty uneasy about power sharing with Sinn Fein if the killer of Robert McCartney is anything to go by.

so he if he killed him he done it for Sinn Fein? how in gods name do you work that out? if a postie murdered someone does that make the post office murderers? where the hell is the logic in that?

 

[Chocohead]

Could you please explain why Blair would bother to go along with this "whitewash"? The SF vote is of no interest to him as Labour do not even run for election in the north. Blair does not and never has given unconditional support to the unionists. Blair has been the best Prime Minister for nationalists in Northern Ireland ever.

damned right he is - but he also lies through his teeth - like its been recently proven with iraq. besides, we dont know what he's been told remember - so how the hell can anyone answer your question? doh.

 

[Chocohead]

i just wish someone could answer me questions rather than waffling on like this

 

[spiritualtramp]

I'll say it once more .. considering we have nothing but hearsay to go on at present - we'll have to wait and see.

we don't just have hearsay - we have arrests to go on now.

 

[spiritualtramp]

so he if he killed him he done it for Sinn Fein? how in gods name do you work that out? if a postie murdered someone does that make the post office murderers? where the hell is the logic in that?

Oh I'm sure he didn't kill him in the name of Sinn Fein. However, this murder shows exactly what kind of utter psychopaths these people are. This chap goes around canvassing for Sinn Fein - would you want to answer your door to such a nutter?

The fact is, this murderer is associated with Sinn Fein. I wouldn't feel comfortable being in the same room as someone associated with such a murderer, let alone being in a government building sharing power.

The fact that Sinn Fein did not call for the witnesses to go to the PSNI is just disgusting.

 

[spiritualtramp]

damned right he is - but he also lies through his teeth - like its been recently proven with iraq. besides, we dont know what he's been told remember - so how the hell can anyone answer your question? doh.

you failed to give me any reason whatsoever why Blair would want to assist in the staging of this "whitewash". what he has been told is irrelevant - you claimed this is some sort of PSNI whitewash to take votes from Sinn Fein. Please explain why Blair would co-operate with this.