new liverpool thread - everyone loves them (3 Viewers)

[nutmeg81]

'Thank God I have left Brendan Rodgers'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/mar/14/nuri-sahin-liverpool-brendan-rodgers?CMP=twt_gu

if he is as good a player as he is made out to be, then he should be able to play a little further up the park. i think he, suso and assaidi haven't had the best of luck with br, but i hope the lateer 2 get a chance next season as i doubt he'll throw them in with 9 games to go.

 

[washingcattle]

if he is as good a player as he is made out to be, then he should be able to play a little further up the park. i think he, suso and assaidi haven't had the best of luck with br, but i hope the lateer 2 get a chance next season as i doubt he'll throw them in with 9 games to go.

I don't think that's true at all. You couldn't push Andrea Pirlo any further forward and expect him to fit there.

 

[Unicron]

I don't think that's true at all. You couldn't push Andrea Pirlo any further forward and expect him to fit there.

Further to that, Pirlo actually was a fairly mediocre 10 when he was at Inter wasn't he?

 

[washingcattle]

Further to that, Pirlo actually was a fairly mediocre 10 when he was at Inter wasn't he?

I wouldn't even say mediocre he barely played for them it was Brescia where they played him deeper according to Wikipedia.

 

[dunderhead]

suarez talking about considering champions league football next year.

what an inconsiderate, selfish bastard. why would one of the worlds greatest forwards even consider leaving a team that are one point ahead of West Bromich Albion.

(inevitable I suppose. shit).

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/live...ons-league-clubs-this-summer-100252-33030521/

 

[maims bond]

Yeah, it's inevitable really. The guy has to be one of the top ten strikers in the world at the minute so he's obviously putting the feelers out. Thing is, you get the impression that he is a really competitive and ambitious guy and any move would be on that basis - champions league football and challenging for domestic leagues.

I'd say the best Pool can hope for is for Rodgers to say to him "Give us one more year to get into the C League, if we don't make it you can leave in 2014". Otherwise, cash in for £40 million this summer but not on fuckin transfer deadline day.

 

[washingcattle]

Yeah, it's inevitable really. The guy has to be one of the top ten strikers in the world at the minute so he's obviously putting the feelers out. Thing is, you get the impression that he is a really competitive and ambitious guy and any move would be on that basis - champions league football and challenging for domestic leagues.

I'd say the best Pool can hope for is for Rodgers to say to him "Give us one more year to get into the C League, if we don't make it you can leave in 2014". Otherwise, cash in for £40 million this summer but not on fuckin transfer deadline day.

Top 10 ? Really ? He's not really an out and out striker is he ? I've always thought he works better in a partnership which few CL level teams really play these days. Don't get me wrong he's right up there.

so who are the top, most wanted lets say "goal scorers"

Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Falcao, Zlat, Villa, Higuain, Benzema, RVP, Lewandozki, Suarez, Cavani, El Sharawi, Aguero,

They're the top ones I can think of off hand. It's not that great a list either.

 

[maims bond]

Top 10 ? Really ? He's not really an out and out striker is he ? I've always thought he works better in a partnership which few CL level teams really play these days. Don't get me wrong he's right up there.

so who are the top, most wanted lets say "goal scorers"

Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Falcao, Zlat, Villa, Higuain, Benzema, RVP, Lewandozki, Suarez, Cavani, El Sharawi, Aguero,

They're the top ones I can think of off hand. It's not that great a list either.

Ok, might be fairer to describe them as forwards. And, on his current form, I think he's up there ahead of Aguero, El Shawari, Benzema, Higuain and Villa. The only players you could comfortably say that are better than him are Messi, Ronnie, RVP and Falcao (maybe Neymar as well). I think you can argue the toss with any other player. Again, this is on current form. What'll likely happen is that Pool will hold onto him this summer and turn down massive offers only for him to spit at a black player and have the worst season ever and be sold the following summer for 12 mil.

 

[washingcattle]

I'd definitely say (not including current form although now that his injury is behind him he's got 3 in 3 games I think ?) That David Villa is as good if not a better player as/than Suarez. If you look at his record and the fact that without him both Spain and Barca of late look a bit of a shambles, a shambles that wins, yes, but a shambles none the less. If anything Villa is underrated.

Without Benzema and Higuain Ronaldo would only get half the goals he does. What I meant by out and out striker is probably defined by those 3 players actually. They lead the line, play on the shoulder of the last man and really give their respective sides a focus. Barca look way better when Villa plays especially instead of Fabregas. I just wonder if Suarez would fit in at the really top sides ? Bayern don't really need him, Barca Real either Man United and Chelski Yes, Other than that ? PSG maybe ? He'd be banging them in at Juve or Napoli.

Not that he's not a top "attacker" though. I'd gladly shell out our Fellani money on him. Ha.

 

[Unicron]

Bayern don't really need him,

Ya think? I'd have him ahead of Gomes the goal machine or Mandzukic

 

[washingcattle]

Ya think? I'd have him ahead of Gomes the goal machine or Mandzukic

Not really the same type of player as Gomez or Mandzukic though, that was the point, even if you could accommodate Suarez, Muller and Kroos in there you'd still want someone like Gomez up front for them to play off.

 

[Unicron]

Not really the same type of player as Gomez or Mandzukic though, that was the point, even if you could accommodate Suarez, Muller and Kroos in there you'd still want someone like Gomez up front for them to play off.

He did a good job playing centre forward for Liverpool this year before Sturridge came in though, and Guardiola eventually settled on Messi there and didn't favour very wingerish wingers in attack at Barcelona. Granted he'll have a different group to work with and needs must etc when he goes to Munich but if I'm Ribery and Robben (Ribery less so, could be a bit Pedroish) I wouldn't be all that confident of my prospect if the new boss intends on imposing a new style on the team, Gomez isn't really a Pep sort either. I could see a Ribery, Suarez, Muller Barca style front 3 doing okay.

Edit: I'm just thinking about this on the basis of him being rumoured to be on Guardiola's "I want" shortlist for next season.

 

[washingcattle]

He did a good job playing centre forward for Liverpool this year before Sturridge came in though, and Guardiola eventually settled on Messi there and didn't favour very wingerish wingers in attack at Barcelona. Granted he'll have a different group to work with and needs must etc when he goes to Munich but if I'm Ribery and Robben (Ribery less so, could be a bit Pedroish) I wouldn't be all that confident of my prospect if the new boss intends on imposing a new style on the team, Gomez isn't really a Pep sort either. I could see a Ribery, Suarez, Muller Barca style front 3 doing okay.

Edit: I'm just thinking about this on the basis of him being rumoured to be on Guardiola's "I want" shortlist for next season.

Yes, and that's all well and good but teams know how to beat Barca now, so if Pep thinks he's going to plough the same furrow and succeed he's dreadfully mistaken.

Suarez is good up front on his own but he's better with a partner.

For all Messis considerable talents he probably wouldn't make it as a "line leader" in any other league except Spain or any other side except Barca. Obviously that's not a criticism. I think Messi is better with Villa in front of him especially in Europe where teams do expect Barca to play straight down the middle directly in front of them the whole time especially, when Fabregas plays. It's all moot anyway Suarez is a fine player Liverpool are really getting the best out of him. If he goes someone will find a place for him alright but it would be a pity because he's playing so well and Liverpool are looking good with their current set up. He could still do with shutting up though.

 

[Hector Grey]

if he is as good a player as he is made out to be, then he should be able to play a little further up the park. i think he, suso and assaidi haven't had the best of luck with br, but i hope the lateer 2 get a chance next season as i doubt he'll throw them in with 9 games to go.

Suso is 18 in fairness. He's had a decent crack this season, and he should only get better. He looks to me like he'd be better in the centre, behind the striker. His time will come again. Assiaidi looked okay on occasion, but he can't have done himself any favours on Sunday, cos he was gash. Mind you he hadn't kicked a ball in months. Having said that, BR has rehabilitated Stew Down so, in theory, he can rehabilitate anyone. Except, obviously, Joke Hole.

 

[Hector Grey]

Yes, and that's all well and good but teams know how to beat Barca now, so if Pep thinks he's going to plough the same furrow and succeed he's dreadfully mistaken.
.

That might be the theory, but is it actually true? Yeah, Barca weren't great over the two legs against PSG, but get this: they're in the semi final and are going to win the league at a canter. So, much as i was cheering for PSG (where's Zlatan's euro cup??), they still didn't beat them.

I really hope it's a Bayern-Dortmund final. A victory for the non-Qatari football.

 

[washingcattle]

That might be the theory, but is it actually true? Yeah, Barca weren't great over the two legs against PSG, but get this: they're in the semi final and are going to win the league at a canter. So, much as i was cheering for PSG (where's Zlatan's euro cup??), they still didn't beat them.

I really hope it's a Bayern-Dortmund final. A victory for the non-Qatari football.

Well sort of yes.

Look Barca haven't played any real contenders yet in the CL. They've been beaten by Celtic and Milan and looked absolutely pedestrian against PSG. They weren't too great in the group either.

Here's how I see it

There was talk of them being a one man team after wednesday. They're not they're a 4 man team. Ineasta, Messi Xavi and Villa. When one of them doesn't play they're sluggish. Everyone knows what Xavi and Ineasta do, fine but without Villa staying right up front on the shoulder of the last man there's no space behind him for Messi to work in. Basically when they play and Fabregas Barca don't look like the side we know and eh... love ? (or at least tolerate and occasionally admire in my case) and Fabregas has played a lot this season.

So yes, teams do know how to beat Barca, but Barca have been doing them a favour for a good chunk of this season by playing Fabregas instead of Villa, they do seem to have sorted this out though.

Also Spanish defenders aren't up to the same standard as the likes of Milan or even Juve or top premier league sides unfortunately Real, Dortmund and Bayern don't look too clever at the back either.

Barca are still a bit too single minded in their approach, so yes I still stand by this. Unless Villa, Messi, Ineasta and Xavi Pedro and Busquets play in which case it's just the sheer quality rather than any tactics that win them matches.

I'd love an all German final. I watched Dortmund vs Bayern in the league this season and it was like watching Arsenal vs United around 2002 or Everton vs Liverpool in the late 80s early 90s full of blood and thunder played at 100 miles an hour lots of technically good play too. To be fair the first half was fairly shit as a spectacle but the 2nd was class A real back and forth contest. It ended 1-1.

 

[Hector Grey]

I think it's pretty straightforward myself. You beat Barca by scoring more goals than them. You do that by not being afraid. And of course, they may be as you say a four man team, but when those four are some of the top players in the world, indeed two of them could be regarded as being in the top 3, then necessarily you are going to be dominated by their presence and ability. There isn't a team in the universe that wouldn't become all about Messi if they had Messi.

I think Barca have gone downhill, but they were still so far up the hill that no matter how much they slide, they still can't see any of the other teams beneath them, but they can still turn it on and destroy any team. All of them. If Barca are barca, they'll beat the lot. If Real or Bayern or Dortmund play as well as they can possibly play, with their best players busting an extra lung and the luck going with them, then sure, they've a chance.

To be honest i want Barca to lose cos they annoy me now. They've begun to fall over a lot when they don't have the ball, rather than the constant pressing they used to do. They're in transition what with the new manager and all, but they could still win it.

Anyway, i suppose my point is that teams know how to beat barca, but very few of them have the balls to do it. So, by default, they're still the best.

 

[washingcattle]

A

I think it's pretty straightforward myself. You beat Barca by scoring more goals than them. You do that by not being afraid. And of course, they may be as you say a four man team, but when those four are some of the top players in the world, indeed two of them could be regarded as being in the top 3, then necessarily you are going to be dominated by their presence and ability. There isn't a team in the universe that wouldn't become all about Messi if they had Messi.

I think Barca have gone downhill, but they were still so far up the hill that no matter how much they slide, they still can't see any of the other teams beneath them, but they can still turn it on and destroy any team. All of them. If Barca are barca, they'll beat the lot. If Real or Bayern or Dortmund play as well as they can possibly play, with their best players busting an extra lung and the luck going with them, then sure, they've a chance.

To be honest i want Barca to lose cos they annoy me now. They've begun to fall over a lot when they don't have the ball, rather than the constant pressing they used to do. They're in transition what with the new manager and all, but they could still win it.

Anyway, i suppose my point is that teams know how to beat barca, but very few of them have the balls to do it. So, by default, they're still the best.

I agree up to a point. To be fair before Mourinho beat them with Inter, no one had a clue how to play against them and not get a hiding never mind beat them.

As far as outscoring them goes, they are still weak defensively probably weaker now that Puyol is permanently injured and even slower than he was, if that's possible, even average teams can get goals against them. Like I said in another thread, if Lavezzi understood how to stay onside PSG could have had 3 or 4 at the Nou Camp.

It's still a matter of containing them though, forcing them to play narrowly and then just getting touch tight to Messi and Ineasta and have a midfielder or 2 who can cover enough ground to always be behind the first man to those two, because they will inevitably beat the first man no problem. Muntari and Ambrossini were immense for Milan doing that,

Bayern have Gustavo and Schwienstiger who are better players so they should on paper have that ability, They need huge performances from Ribery and Robben/Muller tracking Alba and Alvez and if they get that right they can beat them. That's how Mourinho does it anyway. I've even seen (shock horror) Ronaldo and Di Maria tracking runners during El Classico.

It's a huge pity that Manzucik won't get his nonsense yellow card overturned, he'd absolutely batter whoever is at the back for Barca. Gomez is a good poacher but he doesn't work nearly hard enough.

It's going to be class either way.

On your point about falling over, they were always at that. El Classico a few years ago was disgraceful. 5 years ago you couldn't fault them, and they have changed the way people play football for the better. But I can't wait til their day passes to be honest. It's not even them that annoys me, it's the pro Barcelona bias that every pundit on the TV has. It's just horrible to listen to.

The worst example is the commentary which says "ooh look at barcelona they're a model club bringing players from the youth team blah blah blah" You'd swear they were on the same financial level as Everton or Wigan, When in reality they've spent 5 times what Dortmund have. It's frustrating as fuck.

 

[washingcattle]

He's at it again!!!

Fucking cannibal

 

[dunderhead]

yeah, hes fucked.

nice big ban coming right up