Afghan hunger Strikers (1 Viewer)

[mazzyianne]

Just in case people have't heard. I was down there last night, lots of support for them around.
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/76034

discussion in the dail
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/76102

They need blankets and would like to get cards or messages from outside.

 

[RSJ]

Annoying canteen discussion number 5234254: "Irish people lying on trolleys in A&E wards all over the country, but there fuckers get a mobile unit just because they voulantarily go on huger strike". No point in trying to point out that their anger in that case should rest with the government and not these lads. I got up and left when one guy said (to much head nodding all round) "they should all be put in a box, throw it on a plane, and send them back to what ever african country they come from".

 

[classic seanc]

Tá ocras orthu.

 

[jane]

Annoying canteen discussion number 5234254: "Irish people lying on trolleys in A&E wards all over the country, but there fuckers get a mobile unit just because they voulantarily go on huger strike". No point in trying to point out that their anger in that case should rest with the government and not these lads. I got up and left when one guy said (to much head nodding all round) "they should all be put in a box, throw it on a plane, and send them back to what ever african country they come from".

What I just heard on the radio, one of them voxpops -- fucking shocking. "But then they'll all try it!" Um, yeah, because people use hunger striking SO OFTEN AND EVERYTHING. There's a reason the last really well-known hunger strike in IReland was 25 cunting years ago.

Someone said that these guys were former members of the Taliban, and then no one challenged him on it. This is the problem with giving hatemongers an outlet. Yes, fine, free speech, but everyone should have to give fucking some evidence that any of that is in any way, shape, or form a thing to even THINK ABOUT. Without any challenge? Christ.

 

[mazzyianne]

yeah there was a guy there when I was outside st. patricks on tuesday with a banner that called them Taliban terrorists. he said he read it in the Evening Herald and decided to come down and give them a piece of his mind.
Idiot.
If anyone can go there even for an hour or so, there's some scary racist element trying to rile up the local people, so the men could do with as much support as possible.

 

[potlatch]

Get a load of the Irish Times poll comments.

Fuck sake.

 

[RSJ]

Yeah, one of the lads at work said there was some interview on the telly last night (or something?) where they asked some guy if he was formerly al queda (sp?) and he was very vague in answering, and then they asked if he was taliban and he was again vague in answering...?

 

[egg_]

Apparently they have refused to publicly answer any questions about why they feel it's dangerous for them to return to Afghanistan. That strikes me as odd. Also (to paraphrase that nasty old bitch Mary Ellen Synon, who inadvertently makes the occasional good point), it also strikes me as odd that they are refusing to take fluids by mouth, but are happy to take up a hospital bed in order to receive them intravenously

I'm not saying they should necessarily be deported, just pointing out that to automatically support them is as nutty as automatically calling for their deportation.

 

[theoootini]

Apparently they have refused to publicly answer any questions about why they feel it's dangerous for them to return to Afghanistan. That strikes me as odd. Also (to paraphrase that nasty old bitch Mary Ellen Synon, who inadvertently makes the occasional good point), it also strikes me as odd that they are refusing to take fluids by mouth, but are happy to take up a hospital bed in order to receive them intravenously

I'm not saying they should necessarily be deported, just pointing out that to automatically support them is as nutty as automatically calling for their deportation.

feck i wouldnt want to return to afganistan either. just because they havent given explict reasons why they dont want to return doesnt mean theyve done anything wrong/evil/etc...as for taking up hospital beds wouldnt that be a doctors decision not theirs? lack of food is one thing but the body can survive for 4/5 days tops without fluid

 

[spiritualtramp]

The fact is, these men have NOT completed the asylum process. None of them were lined up for deportation. To hunger strike at this stage is just sheer stupidity. Had they all been told they were going to be deported it would perhaps be a different situation.

Could anyone supporting this behaviour kindly explain why these men cannot complete the asylum process like everyone else?

I think there is nothing whatsoever wrong with seeking asylum but to try and jump the queue with what basically amounts to blackmailing self-harm is not the right way to go about it. Not only is it totally dangerous for these Afghans, it is deeply unfair to all asylum seekers that go down the correct route. They have called for an independent opinion on their case - WTF? is Manuel [SIZE=-1]Jordao[/SIZE] not independent or qualified enough? He is the head of UNHCR in Ireland, and he seems to think Irelands asylum system is fair enough.

I think it is really quite sick for people to encourage and support such a pointless and destructive behaviour, but hey, they get to take photos of the poor opressed foreigners to post on indymedia and shout about the evil racist state and wave their anti-war banners about. I get the impression some of the well-meaning fools supporting this would just be as quick to support someone to slash their wrists if it meant they got some nice pictures and articles about it. In reality if they actually gave two fucks about these men they'd be begging them to stop starving themselves RIGHT NOW.

As for the they'll all do it lark - em, yeah. Look at what has been going on in Belgium.

I'm with Manuel [SIZE=-1]Jordao[/SIZE] on this. These chaps should stop what they are doing right now and complete the asylum process like every other asylum seeker has to.

 

[Latex lizzie]

I aggree with you on this..however I think maybe due to the fact that the process is so badly run some people may feel they have no other option thn the extreme approach( I would imagine its a cultural thing too).It's all very well for us to judge this case this way..but I wouldn't be arsed no matter what if I was living here and there was any chance of me going back to afghanistan. that is one country that is just about to go under again big time..taliban insurgents are once again regaining ground and it's only a matter of time before the yanks and the brits do a walk.

 

[mazzyianne]

Apparently they have refused to publicly answer any questions about why they feel it's dangerous for them to return to Afghanistan. That strikes me as odd. Also (to paraphrase that nasty old bitch Mary Ellen Synon, who inadvertently makes the occasional good point), it also strikes me as odd that they are refusing to take fluids by mouth, but are happy to take up a hospital bed in order to receive them intravenously

I'm not saying they should necessarily be deported, just pointing out that to automatically support them is as nutty as automatically calling for their deportation.

I think what most people who are 'automatically supporting them' (as opposed to...doing nothing?) are doing is calling into question the process by which people seek asylum.
It needs to be more transparent. Irish people know fuck all about what grounds people seek asylum under, how many apply, why they are rejected.
The men sent out a statment about why they dont want to return to afghanistan, they are no refusing to talk about it as far as I know, they are chatting about it to anyone who visits anyway.
And your other point about the hospital bed is one of the stupidest things I've heard in a long time.

 

[Raudi Raus Schinkel]

The kids have all been made wards of court now thank God! Fuck's sake, bringin kid's in, ja, really cool!

 

[egg_]

The men sent out a statment about why they dont want to return to afghanistan, they are no refusing to talk about it as far as I know

Really? Maybe I heard wrong. Have you seen the statement? Is it on the web someplace I can read it? (these are genuine questions, btw, I'm not trying to get at you, just to inform myself)

And your other point about the hospital bed is one of the stupidest things I've heard in a long time.

You must hang around with some very clever people ...
I don't think it's stupid at all - to refuse liquids by mouth but to accept them intravenously is kinda, well, bizarre dontcha think? You're probably going to say "Are you saying, egg_, that they should refuse liquids intravenously too and die a speedy death?" and to that I would say "no" but ... ach I dunno. I suppose, to put it baldly, what I mean to says is "lads, are ye seriously going to kill yourselves or not?" cos if they're not then the situation is quite different to what it would be if they are. It's a funny kinda thing to try and figure out, and much as I despise Michael McDowell, if I was in his shoes now I just don't know what I'd do

 

[egg_]

I think what most people who are 'automatically supporting them' (as opposed to...doing nothing?)

As opposed to genuinely trying to figure out the rights and wrongs of the thing.

... are doing is calling into question the process by which people seek asylum. It needs to be more transparent. Irish people know fuck all about what grounds people seek asylum under, how many apply, why they are rejected.

But are these Afghan dudes good sorts of people, that's really what I want to know? If, for example, they're the kinda violent nutcases that the one Afghan I ever met was, then I'd be happier if they were living in Afghanistan, hunger strike or no hunger strike. I realise that the point of the asylum system isn't to sort kind people from mean people, but that what I want to know - if they're sound I support them, if they're dicks I don't. Simple as that. I already agree that the system needs to be more transparent etc., but I don't know if I support these dudes or not. Send me a link to their statement and help me decide
(and come and see my band tonight)

 

[nofunchee]

can i just point out that a hunger strike is a very extreme measure taken by very desperate people. the thirst strike is even more extreme and thank fuck they've started drinking water again. the point is that we are not going to see loads of asylum seekers going on hunger strike. this strike is a very strong indictment of the process here.

according to the first reports the reason that the men went on strike was because some of them got letters of rejection regarding their claims of asylum.

now i can only assume that this reality brought the 41 men together to perform this action in solidarity with one another because they will only be heard as a group and by taking extreme measures.

as regards their reasons for the hunger strike:

Afghanistan has been a country in critical war conditions whether that was Russian Trooops or is Civil War, where human rights records remained poor due to weak central institution and a deadly insurgency.

There are reports of politically motivated or extrajudicial killings by the Government or its Agents. For example torture, official impunity, poor prison conditions, prolonged pretrial detention, abuse of authority by Regional Commanders, restrictions of Freedom of Press, Religion, movement, associations, violence and societal discrimination against Woman and minorities, trafficking in persons, abuse of of workers rights, child labour, etc...

Unacquainted of whole regional current situations in Afghanistan, the Refugee applications commissioner hasn't given full attention and unlawfully refused most of our asylum applications in Ireland. We had a disciplined demonstration against the decisions in Dublin, we were notified to have jusice and our rights, but unfortunately we haven't had a positive response from Justice Office or Court. We left Afghanistan to survive and have our rights protected.

We have been in Ireland for years and most of us have been suffering from mental and physical problems besides the mental and physical problems we had in Afghanistan. We want an answer from the Irish Government, Is it life in Ireland or death?

We couldn't bear this anymore so finally we are her in this Holy Church and have a hunger strike for our future whether that is death or freedom of life.

"33 Afghans all men are locked in St. Patricks Cathedral for the night. They say they will remain on huger strike until death. They are all Asylum seekers turned down on appeal. The Department of Justice said they would meet them tomorrow if they left tonight. They have refused. The Dean and Chaplain were very helpful, the Dean tried to contact McDowell without success and we heard him say Asylum Seekers are treated very badly in this country. Ciaran Cuffe TD and Aengus O'Snoddaigh TD will contact McDowell tomorrow. Many of these men were wounded in Afghanistan indeed one one was even blinded over there. All are anti-Taliban and fought against them."

.

this is from http://www.indymedia.ie/article/76034#comment149073

 

[piratio]

ABSOLUTELY. BUT ONLY WITH A VIEW OF DEPORTING THEM, POST HASTE! More demands from those who have the least right to demand anything. Jeez, it's like inviting someone to your house for a meal and they demand that you buy them a new Mercedes. "NON-NATIONALS" (I love that term. After all I'm one of them) should not be allowed to remain in this or any other country unless they can prove they SIGNIFICANTLY contribute to the economy of the State. The Afghan protestors are merely on a copycat ego trip. They're tired of just sitting around collecting Social welfare and enduring the lousy weather. So. Whata they do for some excitement? That's right. Just like their cousins in France, Denmark, Sweden and Great Britain. They stage a little contentious breach of social etiquette. They, the poor lads (notice no women involved) have a public temper tantrum in the sacred worshiping place of infidels. At the end of the day the government should give these fellows the chance to return to their own country and join the heroic American led coalition in the struggle to free Afghanistan from the evil Taliban foe!
eddie- the Aggravator, Ireland/ex USA

Wow. I'm so glad sometimes that I'm leaving this fucking country.

 

[egg_]

should not be allowed to remain in this or any other country unless they can prove they SIGNIFICANTLY contribute to the economy of the State

... says someone who's obviously utterly ignorant of economics.

 

[egg_]

Hmm that statement doesn't really answer my questions ...
I think if I was minister I'd have them all come into my office one after the other, while a plane revved up outside. If I didn't like them they'd go onto the plane, if I did they'd get asylum

 

[piratio]

Hmm that statement doesn't really answer my questions ...
I think if I was minister I'd have them all come into my office one after the other, while a plane revved up outside. If I didn't like them they'd go onto the plane, if I did they'd get asylum

That seems to be the way it is being done yo. I don't see what the big deal is really. Let em stay. Like I read earlier... They're only here because we let their country rot. We deserve all of it.

b