the iRA and the Bank Robbery (7 Viewers)

[broken arm]

PSNI, RUC, different name, same old force!

.......

 

[oh shit]

they would be very very glad to get rid of the tax draining shithole.

hey! who you calling 'tax draining'???

 

[taubstumm]

today's phoenix magazine has the lowdown, you should grab it.

their take (and their take is usually fairly reliable):

1. adams/mcguinness control of sinn fein has pissed off a lot of ira people for various reasons. some ideological, some practical, some personal.

2. republican sinn fein, real ira and continuity ira are a pack of fuckwits, so the people in sinn fein & ira who are feeling pissed off can't jump ship.

3. the best way to regain influence and/or reduce adams/mcguinness influence is for the anti-adams/mcguinness faction to do something to show they still have muscle.

4. therefore, the robbery was done by republicans (both in the ira & sinn fein and outside/dissident) but without any authorisation from ira or sinn fein.

implications:

1. adams/mcguinness/mainstream sinn fein seriously weakened - they can't conmdemn it, or deny involvement. resurgent hardline in sinn fein without having to resurrect the 'ormed straggle'.

chocohead, your doing a sterling effort here in trying to defend sinn fein, but you're going to have to admit that it's not as simple as you'd like it to be. sure, the unionists and the british government are trying to take advantage of it - blaming the ira, etc, but it's essentially an intra-republican thing going on.

 

[Chocohead]

there have been rumours that south armagh, who never agreed with sinn fein on the peace process, had somethign to do with it.

still though we dont actually know what the story is. we cant say SF was aware of whos involved and I believe we'll be going backwards if we go down the unionst 'no sinn fein' road.

None of this is simple, especially not as simple as 'the IRA done it'

 

[spiritualtramp]

hey! who you calling 'tax draining'???

I do apologise. the north is totally self sufficient, isn't it?

 

[spiritualtramp]

None of this is simple, especially not as simple as 'the IRA done it'

not half as simple and fun for you as blaming the Brits, eh?

 

[Chocohead]

well,if thats the way you wis to look at it ... fine.

I have no idea who done it. I'd just like something better than 'everybody says so' to make me believe it was the IRA and not just idle speculation. If i DID find out it was the IRA, then I'd say much the same sinn fein did recently in that it would be a 'defining moment' as it would be clear they werent interested in peace. at the minute that is not clear.

I totally accept I could be completely wrong, Im just saying this whole thing is a tad weird in its reasoning and its timing.

 

[Chocohead]

though Tom right enough has made some very valid points.

 

[GARYXKNIFEDX]

I've not really followed the news on this,so what evidence is there that is making politicians say they a re 100% certain it was the IRA?

I saw that in a paper yesterday,I think it was Bertie that said it(by the way it was a tabloid in work I read)but the article made no mention of evidence other than people assuming.

 

[Chocohead]

apparently there isnt any. sinn fein have been asking but bertie doesnt answer the phone anymore, and john hume asked the commons and didnt get an answer

 

[GARYXKNIFEDX]

apparently there isnt any. sinn fein have been asking but bertie doesnt answer the phone anymore, and john hume asked the commons and didnt get an answer

Didn't think there was but wanted to check. I think that's insane. Seriously,why have the IRA not said fuck the lot of you to all involved in the peace process. It seems nobody wants them involved.
I really can't believe with no evidence that any politician would make a statement saying who definately commited a huge robbery like that. If it was it was,but don't you need evidence?
Is it any wonder people have no faith in politicians and don't vote.

 

[oh shit]

I do apologise. the north is totally self sufficient, isn't it?

see that was a joke i made cos you called NI
"tax draining shithole"
like i was annoyed about the tax-draining part but agreed with the shithole part.
see?
if you can't take a joke, stay out of NI politics.*

*this is a joke too

 

[Cormcolash]

There was a Spotlight program on BBC1 last night interviewing one of the guys the gangsters forced to help them. It was really good, it showed how utterly incompetent security at the bank was for one thing.
Apparently when the gangster's called to the guys house, they said they were from the local Celtic Supporters Club and that he'd won a prize, and that's how they got in. The guy is a big Celtic man, goes to as many home games as he can, so he believed them.
I would say that going by that, it was definitely Republicans! Still doesn't mean it was the Ra though.

 

[spiritualtramp]

Still doesn't mean it was the Ra though.

oh really?

http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/0217/cork.html

"It is understood that a former Sinn Féin elected representative is among those arrested"

 

[RED(tape)MENACE]

It does seem to be an 'interesting development' in this story.

 

[Chocohead]

now was that the 'councillor', 'former councillor' (like when? 1983?), the 'Sinn fein Activist' or the 'person with close SF links'? Thats the descriptions Ive heard onthe radio today and apparently its all the same man. Pity the media doesnt stick to the same description.

We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[spiritualtramp]

It does seem to be an 'interesting development' in this story.

ever so slightly.

 

[Chocohead]

It does seem to be an 'interesting development' in this story.

peraonlly, at this stage I think all the stories are interesting developments - but this much further on and theres still no evidence of anything. I always wonder why.

If this guy was a former SF rep, then he could have left years ago - theres been a lot of changing in republican circles over the past few years what with people joining republican SF and the realIRA etc, so he mightnt actually have any realistic SF contections anymore. Still, we'll see.

 

[spiritualtramp]

now was that the 'councillor', 'former councillor' (like when? 1983?), the 'Sinn fein Activist' or the 'person with close SF links'? Thats the descriptions Ive heard onthe radio today and apparently its all the same man. Pity the media doesnt stick to the same description.

We'll just have to wait and see.

I'm curious - what are your opinions on the Sinn Fein election worker and community "activist" that cut Robert McCartneys throat and stomach open, beat him with sewer rods and stamped on his head?

 

[Chocohead]

obviously if he done that he should be arrested, face the full force of the law and put in jail. Do you know for a fact he did? I havent really been keeping up with the news