Sexism, god help us (1 Viewer)

[Unicron]

Fair point. Who is organizing it here? What venue? Would it be ok to pressure them into dropping it?

Same thing happened with Chris Brown didn't it?

edit: ACTUALLY, his gig went ahead didn't it? FFS Ireland.

None of the promoters here would touch it. It was promoted by some company from the UK I think

 

[Lili Marlene]

None of the promoters here would touch it. It was promoted by some company from the UK I think

Yeah, O2 wha.

No, I remember that now alright. He didn't stay to engage in the debate on whether or not what he's doing is ok either.

 

[тхеодоре кацзынски]

Change quantities, delete items, change shipping, continue shopping or checkout

$2000 to attend? Wow.
I'm guessing he doesn't actually need a promoter-book room, stick ad on website, count money.

 

[egg_]

No, I remember that now alright. He didn't stay to engage in the debate on whether or not what he's doing is ok either.

Chris Brown didn't hang around after a gig to engage with people who hate him? Would you?

 

[Lili Marlene]

Chris Brown didn't hang around after a gig to engage with people who hate him? Would you?

Well I meant he didn't turn up at any debates (like, say the Trinity Philosophy society, who live off this kinda controversy). The implication being that this fella probably won't either.

Also I was kidding.

 

[jonah]

Keep him the fuck out. Freedom of Speech is one thing, but incitement to violence is quite another. There is no platform for hate.

Look at his video in Japan where he talks about choking women on the street, and his free pass as a white man to shove women's faces into his crotch.

 

[Lili Marlene]

Bearing that in mind I really, REALLY want to hear from the lads who want to pay to go see his lectures.

 

[тхеодоре кацзынски]

Keep him the fuck out. Freedom of Speech is one thing, but incitement to violence is quite another. There is no platform for hate.

Look at his video in Japan where he talks about choking women on the street, and his free pass as a white man to shove women's faces into his crotch.

Free speech is everything, as I've said before banning this guy from the state on the basis that he may say terrible things is not a desirable course of action. Allow him do his thing and if he is found to have broken our laws then prosecute him.
Incitement to violence should only be a prosecutable offence when the threat of violence is immediate.

 

[Space]

Some interesting food for thought:

Feminism is in danger of becoming toxic | Julie Bindel | Comment is free | theguardian.com

 

[nooleen]

there was no "massive kerfuffle led by feminists". there was a barrage of twitter abuse directed at feminists who mentioned the shirt.

 

[rettucs]

Incitement to violence should only be a prosecutable offence when the threat of violence is immediate.

surely its already gone to far by that stage?

its kind of like saying you shouldn't do something about someone endangering someone else until they're approaching them with a knife. Fuck that shit. Nip it in the bud good and early.

And freedom of speech should not include things that will negatively impact the rights, freedom and/or safety of others. So this is not a freedom of speech argument IMO.

 

[Lili Marlene]

The bit in the article that says

It would appear we have forgotten how to target institutions. The tactic du jour is to wind up a crowd and shut down any nuanced discussion or debate. Patriarchy is being left to its own devices while bad and unpalatable men are being taken to task one by one.

rings true though. Although not specifically for feminism, more... everything. I dunno, will clickbait journalism turn out to be a fad?

 

[Cornu Ammonis]

A labyrinth only has one entrance which is also the exit
A maze may have multiple points of entry and points of exit

A maze may have many different confusing pathways choices of path turns dead-ends etc
A labyrinth can only have one single pathway which leads to the centre and back out again from the centre

Then why did Theseus need a ball of twine to find his way back out of the Labyrinth? If it was a simple one-route-fits-all structure he would only have to turn back around.

 

[nooleen]

The bit in the article that says



rings true though. Although not specifically for feminism, more... everything. I dunno, will clickbait journalism turn out to be a fad?

it doesn't ring true at all

it's not an either/or, we can challenge both institutions and individuals

that article is just more clickbait and is talking shite

 

[Lili Marlene]

it doesn't ring true at all

it's not an either/or, we can challenge both institutions and individuals

I guess the issue is that the headlines will always go to the more, eh, ridiculous cases.

that article is just more clickbait and is talking shite

Yes, I suppose it is.

 

[hydromancer]

Then why did Theseus need a ball of twine to find his way back out of the Labyrinth? If it was a simple one-route-fits-all structure he would only have to turn back around.

Fine then labyrinth: definition of labyrinth in Oxford dictionary (British & World English)

 

[jonah]

Julie Bindell is problematic at the very best of times. She's right that we need to look at institutional violence against woman, emotionally, physically, socially. Of course she's right. But trying to school women on what they should and should not be outraged about is bullcrap, its possible and indeed should be encouraged to be angry at both.

 

[hydromancer]

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[jonah]

Free speech is everything, as I've said before banning this guy from the state on the basis that he may say terrible things is not a desirable course of action. Allow him do his thing and if he is found to have broken our laws then prosecute him.
Incitement to violence should only be a prosecutable offence when the threat of violence is immediate.

Yeah but where does this mythical line between immediate threats get drawn? Like when someone is brandishing a weapon? Surely we know by now that speech, and specifically hate speech, can be just as dangerous, its even more creepily illicit. Its hate speech like this that feeds into the rape culture that has for example, led to the death of those 78 women that have been murdered by their spouses since 1996.

Like, this isn't just a case of let him come in and embarrass himself, this is an actual real problem that is a symptom of the physically violent culture we all live in! Dramatic stands, like denying him a visa, need to be made. His seminars can't just be isolated to some fucking dope talking shit, its part of a massive problem that is an immediate threat of violence.

 

[ann post]

Yeah but where does this mythical line between immediate threats get drawn? Like when someone is brandishing a weapon? Surely we know by now that speech, and specifically hate speech, can be just as dangerous, its even more creepily illicit. Its hate speech like this that feeds into the rape culture that has for example, led to the death of those 78 women that have been murdered by their spouses since 1996.

Just to use it as an example, (there was an equal amount of this happening in the opposite direction) Iain Paisley is very likely to never have committed and act of violence in his life, but certainly was a powerful public speaker and had no problem inciting people to do things he never would himself.