MUSIC DOWNLOADS ARE KILLING THE SCENE (2 Viewers)

[CITY BABY]

Check this out: http://www.profaneexistence.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12597&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

Profane Existence owner Dan locked the topic and banned people for their opinions. Amazing. Once again the Crust SS come through in style.

dont know too much about profane existance but Ill never forget what they said in a interview with Barricada (RASH Paris zine) where they were asked are they members or affiliates of the IWW? to which their reply was no as the IWW are too concerned with worker issues and has no relevence to their struggle!zed!zed

 

[pete]

Check this out: http://www.profaneexistence.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=12597&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

here - completely unrelated to the topic at hand, but what's an "indigent pisoner"?

 

[Corm]

I think they meant to write "indignant" prisoner? It's teenage Americans, imprisoned in their bedrooms because their parents won't let them go to the punk rock show.

 

[Corm]

It seems one of the labels who collaborated on our CD release, Fight For Your Mind, gave permission to CAH. I don't think there were any untoward intentions, but the fact remains that someone is essentially making money off of our labours, with that album having cost us over a thousand euros to make - and that's just in terms of the artwork and the recording, without considering the cost of all the gear we bought, from guitars to cabs to heads to drums to strings and everything else, in addition to much more blurry concepts of the huge amount of time we spent writing, rehearsing and touring the music. SKETCH.

 

[AnarchoBob]

Well, even it the record label gave the permission i will still stand upon my belief that what CAH is doing is theft precisely for those factors you listed Corm.

He is making money on something he was not involved in at all and on music he did not contribute to create/produce. What right has he got to make money on something he did not create or helped to create?
And yes, people could say there is the fact he put his time into the website and the whole project, but then again there are out there loads of people that put loads of effort in creating and mantaining webzines, music blogs and so on without expecting anything back and completely for free. Fair enough, if you are offering a service to someone i could understand you wanting to at least get something back for the effort and energies you put into it, but if what you are offering is not your own original material and is stuff you got for free then you should have no right to expect to make a profit on it.

 

[ravishinrikrude]

find out who owes you the cash and demand it off the cunt.

 

[the strange guy]

Mero would have been all over this if Rejected was still going.
Bless him.

 

[Corm]

Yeah, we've told him to cough up every fuckin penny from what he's sold. I don't reckon he's sold that many "copies" of it, but then again there's been over 150 downloads of the album & demo from the blog in less than two weeks. Even if he sold just one, that's still $8 that he's making off us.

In completely unrelated news, there's a lovely Nihilist bootleg in Sentinel Records...

 

[nofunchee]

It seems one of the labels who collaborated on our CD release, Fight For Your Mind, gave permission to CAH. I don't think there were any untoward intentions, but the fact remains that someone is essentially making money off of our labours, with that album having cost us over a thousand euros to make - and that's just in terms of the artwork and the recording, without considering the cost of all the gear we bought, from guitars to cabs to heads to drums to strings and everything else, in addition to much more blurry concepts of the huge amount of time we spent writing, rehearsing and touring the music. SKETCH.

you want people to pay for your instruments?

 

[Daniel]

you want people to pay for your instruments?

Don't forget the strings and plectrums...

 

[Corm]

you want people to pay for your instruments?

Are you joking?

 

[nofunchee]

Are you joking?

no, i agree with your point about people making money off yer hard work and all. i don't really get your point about having spent money on musical instruments.

 

[dregin]

Am I right in saying that, apart from the obvious issue with this guy stealing your album to sell online, you guys also have a problem with MP3s being sold in general? How're they any less valid a media through which to publish music than CDs or Vinyl?? Virtually everyone has an MP3 player. Granted, it'd be more realistic to be selling them at a fraction of the price that that guy's charging, but costs are incurred in both hosting the files and promoting the site.

 

[dregin]

He is making money on something he was not involved in at all and on music he did not contribute to create/produce. What right has he got to make money on something he did not create or helped to create?

What? That's like saying a greengrocer can't sell vegeatbles because they didn't go out and plant/pick them themselves...

 

[Daniel]

Dregin is making sense.

 

[Shorty]

Am I right in saying that, apart from the obvious issue with this guy stealing your album to sell online, you guys also have a problem with MP3s being sold in general? How're they any less valid a media through which to publish music than CDs or Vinyl?? Virtually everyone has an MP3 player. Granted, it'd be more realistic to be selling them at a fraction of the price that that guy's charging, but costs are incurred in both hosting the files and promoting the site.

Eh, hasn't Corm already pointed out that they're available for free elsewhere and from the NDT blog itself. Where is it stated that mp3s are a less valid media, if anything its the ease of access, distribution, reproducibility and gift economy aspect of it that they (NDT) are arguing for. It's the profit motive that is being objected to.

Corm, are you going to stop him from continuing having them for sale and try and get some of the money or what?

It does seem like a miss understanding on the labels part, especially considering the anti business stance of Fight For Your Mind records.

FIGHT FOR YOUR MIND started out as a fanzine in 1997 to follow as a record label in 1998. Has been going ever since. We put out anarchist related music. Not of just ONE musical style only. We put out records of people that believe and live what they are about. Be it PUNK ROCK, HARDCORE, POST HARDCORE, POST ROCK, CRUST PUNK, HIP HOP, FOLK PUNK, REGGAE PUNK, etc... WE DO NOT DO BUSINESS!!! We promote alternative propaganda, ways of living, ways of doing things DIY and NON PROFIT, through our own community BY THE PUNKS, FOR THE PUNKS and we relate this to HIP HOP as well.

 

[dregin]

Aaarrr, I was just looking for clarification.

 

[Shorty]

....

 

[Corm]

no, i agree with your point about people making money off yer hard work and all. i don't really get your point about having spent money on musical instruments.

Nah, I don't reckon people should have their instruments and all bought for them (nice it would be!), which I think is related to the whole "music is none of my business" approach which is echoed by the FFYM Records statement which Shorty just posted. I think that when you have to finance and maintain your band and music yourself, for its own sake and not for profit, then it is intrinsically more meaningful (also, when your amp and guitar actually cost you the wages of whatever amount of hard work, you're going to love it all the more). It demonstrates that the reason you're doing it is not for money (even though you could make a strong argument that people do it for other status-related concerns: popularity, acceptance, free sex etc).

My point was that when someone makes money off the back of our record, which we're happy to have made not-for-profit, especially when they're using various rhetoric like in that guy's message to demonstrate why punks should do this and why it's DIY, well then you can't leave out the fact that it costs money to be in a band, such as in buying & maintaining instruments and a backline, and if anyone's getting any money out of it, it should be the band and the band alone.

 

[dregin]

....

People just seem to be dissing the sale of MP3s as a costless enterprise that is 100% profit. That is all.

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