Veggie/Vegan Punks where do you stand on abortion? (1 Viewer)

[nooleen]

Internet forums are for discussion are they not?
I was interested in my topic which I happen to think is a very valid point...

How the fuck can yas be veggies and vegans if you're pro abortion?
Abortion is fucking murder...this has being bugging me for days and fuck it had to get it of my chest.

various discussions...

I like trifle...esp from M&S with almonds.

....

 

[Janer]

Your dots are killing me

 

[nooleen]

Internet forums are for discussion are they not?
I was interested in my topic which I happen to think is a very valid point...

highlights janer's inability to actually discuss anything except trifle

Your dots are killing me

...

 

[Janer]

I'd better not mention trifle even though I could've being drunk at said time on a Saturday night but the serious Norwich Ban Gardai could be out on patrol

............

 

[nooleen]

muhhhhhhhh muhhhhhhh unnnnghh *slaps himself repeatedly with back of hand, drops trifle and plastic spoon and starts to cry*

...

 

[Janer]

I Have a crush on Janer but don't know how to convey it :heart:

......

 

[nooleen]

you might be right, i always found myself strangely drawn to gonzo out of the muppets as a child.

 

[nooleen]

 

[spuded]

people's opinions ont his subject seem to swing so many different ways, im really not interested in whether people think abortion is 'right' or 'wrong' same way i feel about gay marriage. What I'm more interested in is would you support the legalisation of abortion in ireland? I know plenty of people who don't personally feel comfortable with the idea of abortion but however are pro-choice.

so in my eyes if yer anti-abortion but pro-choice that's fine

but if you honestly feel that as a man you can declare that a women hasn't got the right to abortion i think you should go fuck youself

 

[Janer]

you might be right, i always found myself strangely drawn to gonzo out of the muppets as a child.

 

[nooleen]

too far.

 

[nooleen]

actually:

PS: you might be interested to know i'm eating a tira misu, which means 'mafia trifle' in italian

 

[Janer]

 

[Corm]

maybe some people think its ok to eat animals?

Yeah I guess so...some people think its okay to eat people or cack or marbles too though...? Doesn't really make any difference what some people think, that's just what I think.

or would you call anyone who didn't have the same beliefs as you lazy and selfish? not trying to be argumentative or anything,just wondering.

Definitely not. I couldn't give half, not even a quarter, MAYBE just about an eighth of a shit what other people do. I gave up letting my own personal opinions have any basis on how I relate to people a long time ago -I've got plenty of friends who eat meat or do other things I disagree with, but that's their business. Obviously that only works up to a certain point -if they're a rapist or a nazi or some shit that's not gonna fly, but I'm not going to view them much differently because they eat meat. I'd be far more judgemental and negative towards a friend who wanted to eat meat and agreed with eating meat, but DIDN'T eat meat because it wasn't punk or whatever, then I would towards a friend who DID eat meat.

But that's different to "calling anyone who doesn't have the same beliefs as [me] lazy or selfish". I would still say that meat-eaters are lazy and selfish. It's just that I just don't give a fuck, because everyone in the world is lazy and selfish in their own way, and if they're not, they're a liar or a martyr. If someone can convince me that eating meat, with the modern way its produced and misery it causes, is NOT selfish or lazy, then go right ahead and try.

If I lived in the past and hunted and killed animals myself, because I needed to for survival, that would be a completely different matter altogether. There's no need to eat meat today; it's simply selfish and lazy.

 

[Corm]

So what about wild animals and fish that are hunted and killed to be eaten? they are not bred just to be killed. They are animals who live a natural life. These animals are not killed for the sake of profit these are killed for food.

Well, that's just lovely. Perhaps I'll join you in your meal next time you kill a wild hog and stick it under the grill.

 

[Corm]

Would you give up all you want, to keep the things you've got?
Or would you give up all you've got, to get the things you want?
If we wait until tomorrow, will tomorrow ever come?

is that garth brooks?

ANDREW WK, "TOTALLY STUPID".

 

[Mormon Nailer]

Being pro-choice = believing that a woman should have the right to self-determination over her own body, and is NOT subject to the dominant ideology of capitalist patriarchy. Basically, that she can decide her own future for herself, and not have it determined by other forces.

Being pro-life = believing that a woman as a person is inferior to her status as a child-producer.

I'm probably going to regret wading in here but fuck it here goes.

First off I have zero interest in the vegetarian angle. I worked as a chef for a long time and have worked in a butchers shop too. I have killed animals for food with my own hands and provided the animals are treated humanely I have no moral problem with it.

Janer is dead wrong when he says abortion is murder. Of course it isn't murder.

It is killing though, and that is something your arguments above ignores.

To say it is killing is not to say it is automatically wrong, there are lots of circumstances where killing is regrettable but necessary - but pro-choice people never bother to tackle that, the arguments made are all very similar to yours above, the "get your rosaries off our ovaries".

The definition you give of pro life above is a terrible simplification. The way I see it the pro life perspective has grasped the fundamental fact of biology that pro choice people choose to ignore - that the fetus is a separate individual, totally dependent on yet distinct from the mother.

There are plenty of justifications you can make for abortion but the way I see it any justification that refuses to deal with that fact of biology directly is totally deluded.

 

[nooleen]

i think anyone who reckons their opinion on this matters in any way, unless they're actually trying to decide whether or not to have an abortion, is totally deluded.
this argument should be aborted before we all confuse ourselves any further.

 

[Buzzo]

I have killed animals for food with my own hands and provided the animals are treated humanely I have no moral problem with it.

----------

It is killing though, and that is something your arguments above ignores.

Yo, MN, killing isn't humane. Damage limitation is cool and all, but you're still causing immense suffering.

What Nooly said. I find it offensive that any of you feel you should have a say in what happens to my vag.

 

[Mormon Nailer]

What Nooly said. I find it offensive that any of you feel you should have a say in what happens to my vag.

The way I see it Pro life people don't give a fuck about your vag - they care about the person in it which is a different thing all together.

You can have all the hysterectomies you want I guarantee you there will be no placards.

You cant hope to convince pro life people of anything if you refuse to tackle what for them is the heart of the issue and always preset terrible simplifications of their views.