WRC Protest (1 Viewer)

[Shine]

Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

Very quickly for the few of you who might read this before you leave work or whatnot.
There is a picket tomorrow (Sat 21 april) at 12 noon outside a fake pregnancy counselling agency at 50 Upper Dorset st.

It advertises as an agency which will disuss all 3 options.
Once it gets "abortion-minded" women in, they are shown videos, made to hold little plastic foetuses and told outrageous lies about what abortion is and how it affects women.
It uses delay-tactics to prevent women travelling for abortions and has resulted in women being deeply traumatised, and being forced into later-term abortions.
it has an extremely seedy history - including the running of an illegal adoption agency (basically - "you have the baby, we'll take it off your hands"!)
apparently, they have also been known to ring up to cancel women's appointments in abortion clinics.

It is run by people from fundamentalist christian parties that don't believe in extra-marital sex, or in proper sex-education, or in contraception.

Full story: history, this action and previous action
And i see your good friends over at boards have also been discussing the issue.

Come along if you can or tell a friend.

Many thanks

directions:
it's about 5 mins from the top of o' connell st. keep heading straight up, then turn right on dorset st, the agency is on the right a few doors down from a pharmacy.

picket calls for the agency to be shut down permanently and for proper regulation of pregnancy counselling agencies.

 

[jane]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

I hope there was a good turnout at this. I took a flyer when I was in the Seomra last week, and meant to come along, but couldn't make it in the end. It's insane that not only has that place been open for ages, but it's well-known that they give false information and use illegal tactics, possibly bordering on human rights violations, and yet they are still in operation.

 

[Latex lizzie]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

crazy behaviour altogether..I'm all for the picket etc..but surely what they are doing is also ..illegal????where is the law on this?????

 

[jane]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

crazy behaviour altogether..I'm all for the picket etc..but surely what they are doing is also ..illegal????where is the law on this?????

That's what I'm wondering, too. If preventing someone from getting medical treatment is a human rights violation, then surely cancelling a woman's appointment is tantamount to this?

Is this one of the places that yer wan on Newstalk did an exposé about?

Oh, and to whoever de-repped me for my previous post in this thread -- thanks a million. At least sign your comments.

 

[zero_hero]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

There are legal agencies or 'charities' getting away with the severe pressure tactics of the same. Only thing is they dont claim to be counselling services falsely.

I hope that something gets done about this quickly. I certainly would support any other protests

 

[Shine]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

wow. thanks also for the de-repping. i really don't understand how anyone pro-choice or pro-life could think that this agency is doing anything good. but you may be right though. i am a bad person.

anyway. thanks for your support on this thread (and thanks to at least one of you for coming along!). the protest went well. unfortunately, it's mostly the usual activisty types that do come along, and it would be great if more people could get involved. if anyone wants to know any more about this let me know. also, if anyone has any more ideas on how to move forward against these people, please tell!

crazily enough, it seems that while what is happening in the agency is obviously wrong, it is totally legal. places that give out actual abortion information (ifpa etc) are highly regulated, but anywhere can set up with an anti-choice agenda and be completely un-regulated.

basically (and q recently asked in the dail!) there is no regulation on medical information given out by non-medical people. there's talk of some bill eventually coming up but blah de blah.
this added to the fact that they do not charge for their "services" mean that noone really cares what they are up to, or who gets traumatised by them.

the advertising standards commission don't want to know ("not our problem"), and we hit a dead end at the irish counsellers eh - organisation or whatever - forgive me for not having info on hand.

soooo... anyone got a legal brain on them?!


ps - jane yes - it's the same one - this from the indymedia link about the history of the agency:

In 2000, the agency became known as “Alpha”. They painted over their sign on the Dorset St. premises and changed their Golden Pages listing after this Newstalk documentary: http://www.newstalk.ie/podcasts/library/Abortion/part1.mp3

 

[ernesto]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

i hope they get strung up for forcing their beliefs on those poor vulnerable and probably weak and confused women.
it reminds me of walking through maynooth college and having these people pretending to be having fun and be all nice then pushing pictures of foetuses (foetai?) in my face "abortion is wrong....murder...".
how fucking dare they. believe what you want, yeah, grand..... just get the fucking fuck away from me you 'holyier than thou' excuse for a human. maybe they shouldve been aborted. pricks.
back to the topic....thats just wrong dude. wrong. i really hope those fucks get their come-up-ins.

 

[Shine]

Re: Funda-Mentalist Christian Pregnancy Counselling

*warning - i'm kindof pissed off in this post. not necessary to read. but i'll post it anyway!*


ps - as for human rights violations and the like - definately - or - i would imagine that - many women who have been through seeing these people and ended up having later term abortions than they would ordinarily. also, the man who runs the agency is fond of quoting fundamentalist church-funded research by people like david reardon that says that abortion traumatises women. But (while i am not saying that abortion is a great thing and we all should go out and have them!) real research has shown that the amount of "trauma" that women feel post-abortion is directly related to the type of counselling /nutcases she has been exposed to.
again - not on hand - but i can def search out the link if anyone wants.
though it makes sense - that if you have proper non-directive counselling, you will reach your own decision - the one that is right for you - and that you are likely to be able to live with. if people start throwing images of bloody foetuses or whatever in your face, before your abortion, well, you might just be inclined to be traumatised. dickheads.

on the advice of the owner of the dorset st. agency, i got hold of one of this reardon's books and it is incredibly scary and infuriating to read. he constantly refers to God and God's glory and we, the Church... the whole premise of this book is trying to convince pro-lifers that they should at least pretend to be pro-woman as well. and it's dodgy-research-a-go-go too. he kicked off a huge civil suit movement in the US against abortion providers.

but what are the chances of being able to civil-suit the nutcases he inspires out of action?

"making abortion rare" is the title of the book. weird, but you might think it should be filled with ideas about how to disimpoverish women, how to educate poor women. sex education, contraceptive education, ideas on how to de-stigmatise single parent families, how to increase quality in maternity and childcare...

no way - it's all crusade and legislative and political opportunity and fucking cynical shit.

he says at one point "it won't be moral arguments that topple the abortion industry; it will be women's rights. Ironic, isn't it?". fuckwit. i could go on but i'm waffling and fuming all at once.

but yeah - who wants an "abortion industry" either.
safe, legal, local, free.
some hope?

 

[Shine]

hi moderator - could you let this stand as a thread for a few days and then merge with original one?
edit> if you want to!

Another announcement about the "funda-mentalist christian pregnancy counselling!"

Following a submission to the law-reform commission, calling for regulation of all counselling agencies, there is a protest this Sat 18th Aug at 12 noon, WRC, 50 Upper Dorset st. Here's the indymedia link (which quickly got overrun with youth defence crap) And below (lazy) the blurb from the last protest I posted about.

If anyone wants to help or know more about the campaign, come along or email choiceirelandATgmail.com

It advertises as an agency which will disuss all 3 options.
Once it gets "abortion-minded" women in, they are shown videos, made to hold little plastic foetuses and told outrageous lies about what abortion is and how it affects women.
It uses delay-tactics to prevent women travelling for abortions and has resulted in women being deeply traumatised, and being forced into later-term abortions.
it has an extremely seedy history - including the running of an illegal adoption agency (basically - "you have the baby, we'll take it off your hands"!)
apparently, they have also been known to ring up to cancel women's appointments in abortion clinics.

It is run by people from fundamentalist christian parties that don't believe in extra-marital sex, or in proper sex-education, or in contraception.

Full story: history, this action and previous action
And i see your good friends over at boards have also been discussing the issue.

Come along if you can or tell a friend.

Many thanks

directions:
it's about 5 mins from the top of o' connell st. keep heading straight up, then turn right on dorset st, the agency is on the right a few doors down from a pharmacy.

picket calls for the agency to be shut down permanently and for proper regulation of pregnancy counselling agencies.

 

[billygannon]

I totally didn't do my job here. Oops

 

[Buzzo]

I forwarded the Choice Ireland mailout about this protest to a bunch of my friends yesterday. One of em rang me this morning kind of upset but really happy. She'd had dealings with the agency a couple of years ago and it really fucked her up (she was reminded of this and felt sad). But she was delighted to hear that people are highlighting it because she feels it's inhumane for any woman to be subjected to what she was exposed to when she sought advice.
Well done dudes, I hope there's a good turnout.

 

[Janer]

I totally didn't do my job here. Oops

Why does this thread get "Sticky" status?

 

[jane]

Option 1: Because it does.

Option 2: Because it's an acute, local situation that directly affects and is of concern to a significant number of Thumped posters.

Option 3: Shut the fuck up, janer.

Since you like making choices for women so much, I'll leave the answer up to you.

 

[Janer]

My post was directed at the moderator Billy Gannon.
and in ur reply to making choices for women, where is the choice for the unborn infant?

Here I read this and he would explain far better than I ever could.

Nice manners too Janie.




The arguments here for abortion (I hate saying pro-choice, if anything Pro-Life people are pro-choice in the true meaning of the word) are old, dated and untruthful.

"It's a woman's body" etc. What does that mean exactly? We are talking about a woman's body, AND another humans body in her womb. 2 people (or more), not just the woman. That other person has the right to life just like every other person. That baby is not part of the woman's body (like her arms, legs etc), she/he has their own body and life. How are people blind to this?

How does taking a human life validate women's rights? Every woman does have the right to make conscious decisions - that's stating the obvious.
But nobody should have the right to take someone elses life - that's called murder.

Aoife - you think abortion is "wrong", yet people should be allowed do it? What sort of nonsense is that? If something is wrong than they shoudn't be allowed do it i.e.murder. Why can't you stand up for what you believe, without pandering to these pro-abortionists?

And what's wrong with being pro life?
It's pro-abortion people who piss me right off, trying to convince people to kill innocent humans, and pretending it's a human right, when the most fundamental human right is actually the right to life. Without that right, all other human rights are meaningless and pointless.

I mean what is their problem, really?
How can they not see that it is a human in the womb we are talking about, an individual's life that they want to kill.

Scientist, you say "I believe every woman should have the right to make a concsious decision for themselves ... to do something they choose to do."
Really? Regardless of the moral implications of that decision, or how it impacts someone else? So by your logic, I could argue the following: I make a conscious decision to kill my neighbour, and it is something I choose to do. So therefore I can do it, right? I could even say I am being pro-choice, coz I am choosing death for my neighbour.
I hope this illuminates the falseness of your own logic and thought process for you. Why don't you stop picking on innocent and defenceless humans and defend them instead?

As for the original post, you are all so hypocritical - you all express sympathy for a person who decided to have her baby killed, yet none of you have even mentioned the baby at all. Does the child who had her/his life callously taken not deserve more sympathy or sorrow?

 

[jane]

If you wanted to direct it at billy, you could have sent him a PM about it.

In other words: Shut up, Janer.

EDIT: Oh, and if you can't tell the difference between making an anti-choice argument and actually abusing women and giving them false medical information in order to frighten them into doing what you want, then you're an even bigger misogynist than I'd previously thought. If they were so sure about their anti-choice stance, then why do they need to resort to lying to women about the medical consequences of abortion? If you really wanted the regurgitated statements above to hold any water, you would be opposed to the tactics used by the WRC because they undermine it completely.

 

[Janer]

I have sent him 3 pm's.
And this is a public forum, if you don't like what I say put me on ignore.
Good girl.

 

[killy kill]

Here we go again

 

[jane]

I have sent him 3 pm's.
And this is a public forum, if you don't like what I say put me on ignore.
Good girl.

Three PMs about one sticky? On top of posting it on the thread? I'd consider that borderline harassment.

Nice work. I'd say the anti-choice crowd would be proud of you. You're just the sort of would-be bully that really gets their placards stiff.

 

[Janer]

B4 I ever had a view on abortion I didn't even give it a thought but when I started reading on these forums about "pro choice" I just put 2+2 together with my limited education and realised that the unborn baby has NO CHOICE.

Simple really.

 

[jane]

B4 I ever had a view on abortion I didn't even give it a thought but when I started reading on these forums about "pro choice" I just put 2+2 together with my limited education and realised that the unborn baby has NO CHOICE.

Simple really.

I wish I could see the world in the kind of simplistic, ignorant way you do. I'd be far less neurotic if I pretended complexity didn't exist and thought 2+2=the answer to a complex moral and ethical and medical and human rights question. It must be really nice being too ignorant to experience any kind of inner moral conflict.