The Great Global Warming Swindle (1 Viewer)

[Dixer]

what did it say about these?

Basically that we're pulling the ladder up after us with regards to developing countries and their energy usage. i.e. that its ok for us but if you were to do the same it would be a disaster for humanity so therefore you'll have to rely on wind/solar etc and never, threfore, achieve our level of comfort.

 

[Dixer]

what did it say about these?

Basically that we're pulling the ladder up after us with regards to developing countries and their energy usage. i.e. that its ok for us but if you were to do the same it would be a disaster for humanity so therefore you'll have to rely on wind/solar etc and never, therefore, achieve our level of comfort/quality of life.

 

[tim]

In fairness you could set out to make a documentry about a chosen subject and find people to back up the point you want to make and thus create the illusion of fact.

Michael Moore does it all the time, he'll make a point and then he'll get one person to go "yeah you're right, thats how it happens" and then we are supposed to take it as factual information.

I suppose last nights programme did the same thing to an extent and completely failed to mention the growing hole in the Ozone layer. Some of their "facts" may be true perhaps, I don't know for sure, I didn't do the studies and research but they sure didn't look at the bigger picture and take EVERYTHING into account.

 

[Goodbye]

Yeah, that aspect of things really sucks ass

 

[Dixer]

Double post. 'pologies.

 

[Goodbye]

Yeah, that aspect of things really sucks ass

Sorry, was refering to John D'ohs last post

 

[broken arm]

Basically that we're pulling the ladder up after us with regards to developing countries and their energy usage. i.e. that its ok for us but if you were to do the same it would be a disaster for humanity so therefore you'll have to rely on wind/solar etc and never, therefore, achieve our level of comfort/quality of life.

I'd agree with this if I didn't know what steps developing economies are taking towards sustainable consumption and production. I'd also accept this if I didn't know that there were active international processes/mechanisms for technological and knowledge transfer for sustainable consumption and production - these processes seek to reduce the cost burden on these countries while lifting people up to a better quality of life/comfort.

The notion of everyone reaching a normative level of comfort/quality of life through the same patterns of development is a poor economic argument. It doesn't take into consideration of ecological limits or more importantly ecological justice. Reaching "Our" levels of comfort has had a direct impact on the quality of the majority of the planet - the developed economies are predominantly responsible for anthropogenic climate changei.e. the viewpoint seems to disregard all externalities of our patterns of development.

The short-term costs of action will be far less than the long term costs of doing nothing. I think the particular argument (in the documentary) is deeply irresponsible and lacks the leadership required for dealing with climate change.

 

[nEiLo]

anyone here a climate expert?

 

[broken arm]

anyone here a climate expert?

nope: billygannon is

 

[billygannon]

anyone here a climate expert?

I am.

 

[nEiLo]

I am.

i'm off to lisbon sunday week, what will the weather be like?
thanks

 

[Dixer]

I am.

Everythings gonna be ok, right? They said so on the box last night.

 

[broken arm]

i'm off to lisbon sunday week, what will the weather be like?
thanks

not sure but Lisbon is well boring

 

[Goff]

The Human race is over and we lost.

Other than that, everything's ticketyboo.

 

[Mormon Nailer]

Post from C4 board aboout the programme:

May not mean much to many in Ireland, but it's summed up by a post on the C4 board:
The forthcoming 'documentary' casting doubt on global warming is made by the same bunch that brought you the controversial and plain mendacious "Against Nature" series. That was directed by Martin Durkin, who's a close mate and follower of Frank Furedi, leader of the secretive grouplet that started life in the 80s as the Trotskyist "Revolutionary Communist Party" (though renowned at the time for being neither revolutionary nor communist). The RCP mutated into the "LM Project" (after its house journal "Living Marxism") which specialised in "media entryism", gaining an influence in broadcast media through careful recruitment which enabled it to punch way above its weight and get a dispoportionate amount of airtime on TV and radio. LM then lost a libel suit brought against it by ITN over its mendacious allegation that the Bosnian Serb concentration camp at Omarska didn't exist, and went bust. It relaunched itself, phoenix-like, as the Institute of Ideas, and hydra-like appeared in a number of different guises as front organisations (a classic tactic of Trotskyist sects), such as Spiked Online, Sense About Science, and many other fronts too numerous to mention here (see links below for further info).

The main principles of this exclusive sect/cult are:

1. Unrestricted economic progress.
2. A rabid anti-Green stance (following from 1, as Greens are seen as hindering economic growth).
3. "Unconditional support" for nations under attack by imperialism, hence the sect's highly controversial support of the Serb side in the Balkan Wars of the 80s.
4. A belief in "Enlightenment values" and humanism.
5. A deep loathing of the Left in all its guises.
6. An uncompromising 'freedom from' libertarianism, akin to that promulgated by Right groupings in the US.

RCP/LM personnel, in particular Frank "Dear Leader" Furedi, featured prominently in Against Nature, which was rightly censured by TV authorities for seriously misrepresenting and misquoting Greens who appeared on the programme. In the discussion after the last prog in the series, George Monbiot immediately said that the series was sponsored and made by the RCP/LM, to which Durkin replied with lots of bluster about "witch-hunts" but at no time denied the accusation. It'll be interesting to see, if there is a discussion after this programme, what he has to say about his backers.

For further reading on this small but highly influential sect, see:

Lobbywatch.org: LM Watch
http://www.lobbywatch.org/p1temp.asp?pid=39&page=1

Sourcewatch: LM group
http://www.sourcewatch.org/wiki.phtml?title=LM_group

Wikipedia: Revolutionary Communist Party (UK)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Communist_Party_( Furedi)

Invasion of the Entryists
http://www.monbiot.com/archives/2003/12/09/invasion-of-the-e ntryists/

The Guardian: Life after Living Marxism
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4038177,00. html

Weekly Worker: Farewell Living Marxism
http://www.cpgb.org.uk/worker/344/farewellLM.html

On Martin Durkin:

GMWatch.org
http://www.gmwatch.org/profile1.asp?PrId=39

Booman Tribune: Global Warming Denier
http://www.boomantribune.com/story/2007/3/6/8814/25388
{This is a recent article looking at Durkin's track record, and previewing the forthcoming programme

 

[broken arm]

sorry, from the guardin..

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2031455,00.html

A Leading US climate scientist is considering legal action after he says he was duped into appearing in a Channel 4 documentary that claimed man-made global warming is a myth. Carl Wunsch, professor of physical oceanography at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, said the film, The Great Global Warming Swindle, was 'grossly distorted' and 'as close to pure propaganda as anything since World War Two'.

He says his comments in the film were taken out of context and that he would not have agreed to take part if he had known it would argue that man-made global warming was not a serious threat. 'I thought they were trying to educate the public about the complexities of climate change,' he said. 'This seems like a deliberate attempt to exploit someone who is on the other side of the issue.' He is considering a complaint to Ofcom, the broadcast regulator.

 

[aoboa]

Did anyone read the article in yesterdays Sunday Times Magazine about global warming - the one that ended with fireballs of methane ripping across the sky burning everything in sight?
Heartwarming stuff!

 

[billygannon]

i'm off to lisbon sunday week, what will the weather be like?
thanks

Light rain with a touch of fandango

 

[Dktr. Faustus]

Great news! Can anyone help me emit more carbon house and cccp gases into the air now when its safe again? Its gonna be gas - blowing up some old refrigerators and shit like that

 

[tim]

Back to square one so.