Nursery Rhymes (1 Viewer)

[Lili Marlene]

do you parents teach them to your children or have books/recordings of them around the house?

The intricacy of something like Oranges and Lemons is fascinating, if you're me.

 

[egg_]

Yeah we've a book of nursery rhymes that gets read regularly. They're kinda mad things, I'm convinced some of them used to be political (3 blind mice, for instance)

 

[snakybus]

Goosey Goosey Gander was political for sure

It was about a left-wing marxist goose

didn't appreciate being called a honky

 

[Lili Marlene]

Some of them have got a fairly well known political history, see this for example on 'mary mary quite contrary'. A fair few's 'meaning' is thought to be forgotten but to be honest a lot of it is guesswork, looking for something 'deeper' in the rhymes, similar to fairy tales.
I'd hate to see them die out though, whatever the truth is.

 

[Wilbert]

Goosey Goosey Gander was political for sure

It was about a left-wing marxist goose

didn't appreciate being called a honky

Just.....shockingly......bad....and.....awful.

 

[Lili Marlene]

Goosey Goosey Gander was political for sure

It was about a left-wing marxist goose

didn't appreciate being called a honky

not quite

The origins of the nursery rhyme are believed to date back to the 16th century and refer to necessity for Catholic priests to hide in 'Priest Holes' ( very small secret rooms once found in many great houses in England) to avoid persecution from zealous Protestants who were totally against the old Catholic religion. If caught both the priest and members of any family found harbouring them were executed. The moral in Goosey Goosey Gander's lyrics imply that something unpleasant would surely happen to anyone failing to say their prayers correctly - meaning the Protestant Prayers, said in English as opposed to Catholic prayers which were said in Latin!

Goosey Goosey Gander where shall I wander,
Upstairs, downstairs and in my lady's chamber
There I met an old man who wouldn't say his prayers,
I took him by the left leg and threw him down the stairs.

 

[Squiggle]

"Ring a ring of rosies" is about the Black Death

 

[Bladez]

"Ring a ring of rosies" is about the Black Death

That's a myth apparently...

A popular misinterpretation[3] connects the poem with the Great Plague of London in 1665, or perhaps earlier outbreaks of bubonic plague in England;[4] however, there is no evidence that Ring a Ring O'Roses and the plague were connected, until it was proposed in the 20th century.[5] Regardless, this interpretation has entered into popular culture and is often used to reference the plague obliquely.[6] This plague link seems to originate with the movement for finding origins of folk-songs, which was popular in the early 20th century.[7] For example, according to the common forms of the plague interpretation, the 'falling down' has always involved dropping to the ground as the rhyme is recited, evoking the death from the plague. This conjecture has evolved into a complex explanation suggesting possible plague interpretations for every line. For other attempts to attribute 'hidden meaning' to other such rhymes see Sing a Song of Sixpence, Mary, Mary, Quite Contrary, and Cock Robin.

 

[Lili Marlene]

humm, that all links to a snopes page debunking the 'myth' that, to be honest, doesn't debunk it especially well. Also, their alternative explanation is no better or worse in my opinion.

but yeah, I'd agree that there is probably too much focus on finding 'hidden' meanings in nursery rhymes.

 

[Scientician 0.8]

Is it Private Eye that has contemporary Nursery Rhymes?

 

[egg_]

but yeah, I'd agree that there is probably too much focus on finding 'hidden' meanings in nursery rhymes.

Haha. Too much focus? I 'm quite sure the percentage of nursery rhyme "consumers" who even consider their origins (or hidden meanings) is vanishingly small

 

[Lili Marlene]

It was the first thing you said about them!

You're probably right though, i'm just all college-d up at the moment so I assume everyone thinks too much about stuff.

 

[egg_]

It was the first thing you said about them!

Sadly, not everyone is like me

 

[Goff]

What's the one about Napolean?

Ah, sure they're all mad. A way of passing on our prejudices to our childer.

Probably.

 

[Anthony]

we've a few books of nursery rhymes. kids love them, especially when they're learning to talk.

 

[Diddles]

John, did you read me post about Froggie went a Courtin?

http://www.thumped.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=50086&highlight=froggie

Interesting history to it.

 

[muffin]

i know with kids in school, they usually are quite taken with the sounds of the letters and words, the rhyming words and the word,letter,sound reptition,

sometimes more than the actual content of the rhyme..

oh and as an interesting note:when i was teaching and we were talking about fairy tales very few of the kids actually seemed to know the traditional versions of the stories..now they mostly seems to know the disney/shrek and god knows what else versions of them..imagine my face when 4 yr olds were asking me when chicken licken was gonna kiss ducky lucky when we were reading the story..so people with kids:do you read them the traditional versions of the stories or the newer more modern ones?

 

[Squiggle]

oh and as an interesting note:when i was teaching and we were talking about fairy tales very few of the kids actually seemed to know the traditional versions of the stories..now they mostly seems to know the disney/shrek and god knows what else versions of them..imagine my face when 4 yr olds were asking me when chicken licken was gonna kiss ducky lucky when we were reading the story..so people with kids:do you read them the traditional versions of the stories or the newer more modern ones?

Oh, good grief. My children will be read the originals - the grim Grimms Fairy Tales. Probably also Beatrix Potter, Kenneth Grahme, A. A. Milne etc. None of that Disneyised stuff!

 

[muffin]

yeah its pretty scary..that said i did have to take out the bit where the wolf is burned and cooked alive in the 3 pigs..i didnt wanna give them nightmares!!

 

[Lili Marlene]

oh and as an interesting note:when i was teaching and we were talking about fairy tales very few of the kids actually seemed to know the traditional versions of the stories..now they mostly seems to know the disney/shrek and god knows what else versions of them..imagine my face when 4 yr olds were asking me when chicken licken was gonna kiss ducky lucky when we were reading the story..so people with kids:do you read them the traditional versions of the stories or the newer more modern ones?

That whole 'traditional' thing is a can of worms. At what point did this tradition start?
You know there are some early versions of little red riding hood that involve a) a strip tease b) "you're a slut" c) little red riding hood escaping from the wolf by saying she has to pee d) the wolf wondering why she hasn't come back shouting "are you making cables out there?"