The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emancipat (1 Viewer)

[Denny Oubidoux]

Has anyone ever heard of The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emancipation Alliance? Ive reading this book about Eoin O'Duffy (the blueshirt) by fearghal mcgarry and i came across them in that. apparently it was founded by some guy called John Barry and they wanted to bring about an end to "priestcraft and skypilot manipulation of education". according to me book they were also in favour of building "longitudinal, transverse, diagonal and coastal highways, the planting of fruit trees along roads and architectural remodelling of villages to supply them with astronomical observatories, electric yachts and dirigible airships". They/he organised an international anti-god congress for galway in 1934 but the blueshirts and the priests and county council of leitrim took against it and in the end it never happened. cant find any mention of all this on the internet though. i'll vote for them next time if theyre still around.

 

[Franco]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Aint no party like an Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emancipation Alliance party.

 

[Carlow Punks!]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Wonder why Leitrim county council was involved if it was in galway?

While stuck in Carrick-on-Shannon for a few hours I happened upon a local history book in the library on a local character from the early days of the Free state who was involved in socialist activities in the area (soviet Farmer's Co-ops and a non-religious youth club...the very thought!) and fell foul of the local authorities and priests. I wonder if he was the same guy, and that was the Leitrim link.

sorry I can't remember any more...be very interested to know more about that party as well. post any more info if you find it!!

 

[Scientician 0.8]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Not exactly to do with that but Das Nugs has a book with this amazing mock-up of what Croke Park would look like in the future. It had maglev stations and dirigible ports and mad shit like that. The picture was from the '30s or '40s. Like a still from Metropolis except there's a scoreboard with "Leitrim 10-3, Corcaigh 4-2" or something like that.

 

[taubstumm]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

plenty of hidden history in the strangest places... cootehill, co. cavan - communist codgers:

The Cootehill of this era has a surprising link to communist and labour history, as well. A branch of the First International was established in Cootehill in 1872, along with branches in Dublin, Cork, and Belfast.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

apparently The Swan on aungier st was full of commies. anyway, i gather from that short paragraph i read about them that The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emancipation Alliance wasnt a particularly big thing. i must have a look at work at some of the academic databases. anyway, this is probably a terrible copyright infringement but heres the paragraph from the book (on the right hand page):

 

[Carlow Punks!]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Wonder why Leitrim county council was involved if it was in galway?

While stuck in Carrick-on-Shannon for a few hours I happened upon a local history book in the library on a local character from the early days of the Free state who was involved in socialist activities in the area (soviet Farmer's Co-ops and a non-religious youth club...the very thought!) and fell foul of the local authorities and priests. I wonder if he was the same guy, and that was the Leitrim link.

sorry I can't remember any more...be very interested to know more about that party as well. post any more info if you find it!!

After looking at your scanned text there, obviously Jim Gralton's my man.

 

[Carlow Punks!]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

After looking at your scanned text there, obviously Jim Gralton's my man.

wow..I've never quoted myself before

 

[CITY BABY]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Not exactly to do with that but Das Nugs has a book with this amazing mock-up of what Croke Park would look like in the future. It had maglev stations and dirigible ports and mad shit like that. The picture was from the '30s or '40s. Like a still from Metropolis except there's a scoreboard with "Leitrim 10-3, Corcaigh 4-2" or something like that.

I have that picture in a book as well .its from 1941. fuckin mad looking! the one with the two colllosal hurls and massive football?

pity me scanner isnt workin

 

[Antrophe]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

wow..I've never quoted myself before

There's some stuff on Indymedia about Gralton, the Labour Party do commemorate him every year;

http://www.indymedia.ie/article/75712
http://www.indymedia.ie/article/68209

There was probably hundreds of lefties like him treated like this.

Heard a story about the mine workers in Castlecomer, they were one of only two unions in Ireland to affiliate to the Comintern after the Russian Revolution, hence their meeting hall was called the Kremlin locally. As a more revolutionary fervor died away, they maintained relations with the USSR doing cultural exchanges and stuff for a few years. This went dead and then in the forties a farmer who had been a miner tried to revive it and went over to an international training school for new agricultural methods, on his return the priest read him from the altar and no one in the community spoke to him until the day he died in the mid 1980's. Harsh.

 

[jane]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Weird. I just did research for a documentary on radical socialists in early 20th century IReland. I was dealing with the period 1918-1923, but I'll see if there's anything on this lot in any of the books I've got laying around.

Labour history is deadly, if a bit disappointing. They had such high hopes, but the labour movement in Ireland never really did have any teeth. some fantastic stories, though. The first ever declaration of a workers' soviet in Ireland was at Monaghan Mental Asylum in January 1918. The workers took over the gaff because they hadn't received a wage rise they'd been promised. The local authorities got freaked out and soldiers surrounded the building. The inmates in the asylum sided with the workers and said that if the soldiers attacked, they'd give it socks.

In the end, the workers were given their pay rise, and despite the management's scabbiness in their offer to give it only to the men (women would have got one, but only a tiny one), the protesters actually held out until the pay rise was for both male and female workers.

Nuts. There were hundreds of workers' soviets declared in Ireland between 1918 and 1923, although they weren't necessarily soviets in the strictest sense of the word (in terms of its original defnition minus the modern baggage). It was a term applied to a range of labour activities and strike actions, though there were some pretty amazing things that happened. There was a general strike in Limerick in 1919 that is generally called the 'Limerick Soviet'.

Anyway, if you look up old issues of the Voice of Labour or Watchword of Labour (same paper, just had two different names), you may find something. It was a paper established by Cathal O'Shannon (the father of the broadcaster by the same name), and they have them in the National Library.

ETA: Oh, and the radical socialists in Ireland also tended to have strong opinions about gender equality, doing away with the dominance of the church, etc. Except there are also instances of special masses being held in support of striking workers.

 

[wageslave]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Nuts. There were hundreds of workers' soviets declared in Ireland between 1918 and 1923, although they weren't necessarily soviets in the strictest sense of the word (in terms of its original defnition minus the modern baggage).

There was a general strike in Limerick in 1919 that is generally called the 'Limerick Soviet'.

hi Jane,

Where would you get a decently comprehensive list of these? And when is that documentary being made / due to air?


Anyone interested in the Limerick Soviet could go here: http://www.limericksoviet.com/index.html for the text of a book, or here: http://flag.blackened.net/revolt/talks/limerick.html for the text of a much smaller talk.

 

[jane]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

hi Jane,

Where would you get a decently comprehensive list of these? And when is that documentary being made / due to air?


Anyone interested in the Limerick Soviet could go here: http://www.limericksoviet.com/index.html for the text of a book, or here: http://flag.blackened.net/revolt/talks/limerick.html for the text of a much smaller talk.

I recommend that book. I met the guy who wrote it about talking with us, and we ended up chatting for like five hours about everything and anything. He's really interesting and a lovely bloke to boot. The book is good, though Cahill himself said that he would revise a few of his overall conclusions, that perhaps in some way, it was that some of the radical socialist values were indeed absorbed by more mainstream political movements -- it's a slightly more optimistic interpretation, even if these values were greatly diluted when all the parties became much more conservative.

The documentary is going to be on TG4 in the spring of 2008. There isn't really a comprehensive list as far as I know, but a labour historian called Emmet O'Connor (originally from Waterford, but now based in Derry) has written a fair bit on soviet actions during this period. The movement seems to have been very much Munster-based, although there are examples of soviets happening elsewhere in Ireland (there were a few in Dublin, including one in Harold's Cross somewhere). Waterford's labour history is really interesting, and there were lots of farm strikes and agricultural worker takeovers and such, and parts of rural Waterford are still strong labour strongholds.

Unfortunately, one of the most interesting aspects is that as a historical/social phenomenon, the soviet movement was kind of deliberately forgotten by historians and the descendents of participants, partly because it was eclipsed by Civil War politics. Equally unfortunately, the deliberate erasing of history leaves you with little to go on. Even some of the primary source material seems to have been destroyed. A lot of the movements lacked the support of the ITGWU, but I did come across some references to them in the issues of Voice of Labour that I went through.

Also, if you go to the Limerick City Museum's website and go through some of the Old Limerick Journals (they're online), you'll find some articles on the subject.

These are some of the more significant ones that I can remember off the top of my head:

* The Limerick Soviet, April 1919 -- there is a display about this in the Limerick City Museum. The strikers printed their own currency, and some of the notes are on display, along with other interesting bits and bobs.
* The Waterford Gas Soviet, 1923
* Tipperary Gas Soviet -- Tipperary Town, which was a big one, but I don't really know anything about this one.
* Castleconnell Soviet (Co Limerick), in which workers took over the eel fisheries of Sir Anthony Mackey (not of Large Mound, but I keep meaning to ask if they're related). Not a significant one politically or historically, but interesting.
* The Cleeves Creamery Soviets: the Cleeves family owned a shiteload of different industrial interests, including a bunch of creameries, and they were all taken over by workers more than once. Knocklong is the best known, and then another was in Carrick-on-Suir, but there were lots of others

Most of the time, the workers caved when their wage demands were met, or they reached a compromise with their employers. If you read Emmet O'Connor's Labour History of Ireland or Labour History of Waterford, you'll learn a fair bit.

There's information out there, but it's kind of scanty, and I found a lot of times, there was, "Oh, so-and-so would have remembered, but he/she died a few months ago". Basically, most of the people died before there was much of an interest in writing or talking about the period.

That any good to ya?

 

[wageslave]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Yeah thats great thanks. Any time I tried looking into this i always found that everything seemed to be relying on the same sources. I think kthe deliberate overlooking effect hit it big time - it didn't fir into either camps view of what should be going on in the country.

I remember finding a book written by a unionist about the period from 1916 to 1922 where he gives out loads about leftie pesants taking over land and then praises the IRa for driving them off! have never been able to find it since though...

 

[jane]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

Yeah thats great thanks. Any time I tried looking into this i always found that everything seemed to be relying on the same sources. I think kthe deliberate overlooking effect hit it big time - it didn't fir into either camps view of what should be going on in the country.

I remember finding a book written by a unionist about the period from 1916 to 1922 where he gives out loads about leftie pesants taking over land and then praises the IRa for driving them off! have never been able to find it since though...

The relationship between the radicals and hte IRA is a confusing one, actually. They were called in to break strikes a few times, but then I also heard stories where they were called in to fuck shit up, but then realised that they had more in common with the people they were sent to beat on than they did with those who sent them, and backed off instead. But then, the greater level of labour activity in IRA-controlled Munster, would have meant that the agitators were creating a problem for the anti-Treatyites, even if they might have agreed with what they stood for.

Radical labour didn't fit either camp's view because, like the early Labour party, it was essentially anti-treaty, but Irish independence was not their primary cause so it wasn't necessarily part of their overall agenda (and anyway, some wanted a Workers' Republic, so they objected just as strongly to the structure of the newly independent Ireland as they did to it under British rule, and I did come across references to this). Historically, it was overlooked partly out of deliberate omission, and also because the creation of historical narratives involves simplification, into which offshoots and side movements complicate a book that is meant to tell a more or less linear story.

The thing is, the history of it also has to be seen in context: it's not very much remembered historically or in popular culture, but until fairly recently, neither was the Civil War.

There's also the fact that some of the leaders of the strikes were not Irish-born. Although you might come across Irish names, some of these were aliases used by English and Scottish activists who came to Ireland, some of them possibly to avoid conscription. There was also support in the UK for Irish labour radicals ,which would have confused the independence issue even more, at least in a historical sense.

 

[wageslave]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

hmmm, well I'll be looking forward to seeing this show anyway!

 

[subbuteo !]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

apparently The Swan on aungier st was full of commies. anyway, i gather from that short paragraph i read about them that The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emancipation Alliance wasnt a particularly big thing. i must have a look at work at some of the academic databases. anyway, this is probably a terrible copyright infringement but heres the paragraph from the book (on the right hand page):

hey whats that book?

 

[Scientician 0.8]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

The Red Flag was written by an Irishman (I'm sure ye all know that but I thought I'd mention it), Jim Connell. There's a great song called Labour's Call by Peadar Kearney that you can download in .MP2 format here.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

hey whats that book?

its Eoin O'Duffy: A Self-Made Hero by Fearghal McGarry. its a good read, he's an interesting character and its well written. my history isnt great so a lot of the background info is new and exciting to me...

 

[jane]

Re: The Irish Workers' Republican, Atheist, Birth Control, Civil and Industrial Emanc

The Red Flag was written by an Irishman (I'm sure ye all know that but I thought I'd mention it), Jim Connell. There's a great song called Labour's Call by Peadar Kearney that you can download in .MP2 format here.

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that! When I was looking at the old labour papers, I came across some pretty poor poems and songs by a guy called Liam O'Brosnahan. His actual poetic structure was a bit 'man from Nantucket', but he was very prolific and it's all very "Hey ho, raise the red flag". He'd actually be a fairly interesting fellow to look into.

Another interesting question I have is, why the Irish radical labour movement in the early 20th century produced so little in the way of decent literature or art? I'm sure it's all tied up in the fact that literature and the arts were largely dominated by the Anglo-Irish, who were less likely to be invovled in a labour movement, but still, it seems like that's not a totally adequate answer.