[Sunday Business Post] Irish music industry hit by downloading (1 Viewer)

[jane]

I think the Radiohead thing was actually some pointless test of music-fan altruism/goodwill (picture an indie parent "I'm not going to tell you not to eat that chewing gum off the ground - I'm just going to trust you to make the right choice").

I don't own an ipod, nor do i download music (don't like listening to music on headphones you see) so I'm the worst person to talk about trends in the music industry, but I would have thought that a person who doesn't own any albums would be just as much a laughing stock among the music fans of the world as someone who cites a greatest hits collection as their favourite album of all time. You see - peer pressure can be a force for good too.

Ro, you are my favourite pull-my-finger-fuddy-duddy.

I also don't really download music. Especially music produced more than a couple of years ago, mainly because bands and artists put energy into how their albums are compiled, and that's part of the whole package. I will buy a CD and load it onto the MP3 player for running or whatever, but I like listening to albums all the way through. If I just want a jingle, I'll watch a Vodafone ad, and if I only like an artist enough to download one song, they weren't going to sell me an album anyway. I still love albums, and Mr Jane bought me a really cool record player for christmas and I can't wait to start collecting vinyl again.

Independent record stores are not just cool because they're indie, but also because they've always been run by people who choose carefully what they carry. I found a lot of great music when I was a clueless 14 year old by trawling through bins of records. Music blogs with downloads have to some extent replaced that, and I can't speak for anyone else, but I still like buying albums. Downloads just don't have the same thrill for me, although streaming web players and DLs have saved me from buying crummy albums. But again, the thing that saved me from crummy albums when I was first getting into music was that I'd buy from shops I felt I could trust.

CDs *seem* to have got more expensive, but in reality, they are cheaper than they have ever been, it's just that in comparison with downloads, they seem expensive. I prefer to buy as close to the source as possible, but I know artists don't make much off them.

I don't know what I'm trying to say here. Maybe I shoudl go find some feminist research to wed.

Ro, could you do a pun for me please?

 

[São Paulo Punk]

...yet strangely, the Irish music scene has never been healthier. Strange that....

PS. For all you close minded biggots, I got married to a study entitled 'Examining an increase in holiday home constuction across the Shannon basin' four years ago and we've never been happier...

I just popped the question last night to a study entitled 'Behavioral Endocrinology of Mammalian Fatherhood'. It said that I would have to submit the proposal to the relative department and that we could possibly book the Skylon Hotel for April 2009 as a provisional deadline. :heart::heart::heart:

 

[aoboa]

I buy almost all my cds and records online.
I pop into Road to buy indie Irish stuff.
I don't download music (except the odd mix or old deleted/oop record).
I would imagine that my record buying profile matches that of thousands of other people in Ireland.
And I'd say that this profile hurts reported record sales far more than downloading.

 

[rettucs]

CDs *seem* to have got more expensive, but in reality, they are cheaper than they have ever been, it's just that in comparison with downloads, they seem expensive. I prefer to buy as close to the source as possible, but I know artists don't make much off them.

record companies mass produce shite these days. Thats the difference. There was an article in the Ticket 2 fridays ago about how, if a record company finds a band that people like, another record company will have a clone band in a matter of weeks. The example was Lilly Allen and Kate Nash. There was some Arctic Monkeys clone too but I forget who they were. How can anyone take a chance on an album anymore when thats the attitude of record companies?

Admittedly, thats the bigger ones. I'd still maintain that labels like Sub Pop or Bella Union, or even a lot of the ones closer to home (TMIAT, OOAL, etc) put a bit more effort into what they're letting out and as a result are often worth a punt.

 

[Anthony]

The download before you buy argument is running out of time, it's very easy to hear most bands online for free through files they put online themselves, myspace, last fm etc.
People are growing up thinking they have a right to get music for free, like it was water.

 

[MDR]

Ro, could you do a pun for me please?

How about (this is asking Kids to pay for downloads ok?):

"Put your money where your mouse is"

Edit: someone thought of that already.

 

[São Paulo Punk]

I dunno. I rarely, if ever, download any music off the internet, but every once in a while a friend calls around with a cd or usb stick with a load of albums on it and gives it to me. I listen to whats on it, keep what I like and get rid of the rest, so the fact of whether or not the albums that i dont like are there is irrelevant because, shared/downloaded or not, they go straight to the trash bin. To me, it seems like a more fast and efficient way of tape swapping or cd burning, if that makes any sense.

Who honestly gives a fuck about the record industry in any case? I'd be more interested to see an economic study of independent Irish record sales and what impacts or correllations could be drawn between file-sharing and the increase/decrease of independent record sales in the last 3-5 years and finally put an end to all this huffin' and a fussin'.

 

[Vinnie]

I buy almost all my cds and records online.
I pop into Road to buy indie Irish stuff.
I don't download music (except the odd mix or old deleted/oop record).
I would imagine that my record buying profile matches that of thousands of other people in Ireland.
And I'd say that this profile hurts reported record sales far more than downloading.

To be honest, the lack of decent mainstream releases would have been what hurt the Irish & UK industry most last year. It's like the majors & key indies have given up the ghost and if it aint ring toneable it aint marketable(hyperbole). That's the price you pay for making 8-12 year olds your key demographic. With adults you have their gradual shift in music taste for 50 years but with kids it's like trying to play chess with a blind lunatic.

 

[avernus]

I'm pretty sure that anything I've downloaded and liked / loved, I've bought. I like artwork. I like CDs. I also like paying for good music. I do like to try before I buy, but I rarely download albums. What I don't get, is people paying illegal sites to download albums. Like - allofmp3.com etc. That is flat out insane. Steal it, by all means. But pay some prick to steal it for you? Fuck yourself.

 

[Denny Oubidoux]

I'm pretty sure that anything I've downloaded and liked / loved, I've bought. I like artwork. I like CDs. I also like paying for good music. I do like to try before I buy, but I rarely download albums. What I don't get, is people paying illegal sites to download albums. Like - allofmp3.com etc. That is flat out insane. Steal it, by all means. But pay some prick to steal it for you? Fuck yourself.

i'd say people who do that don't have a clue what they're doing though.

i cant get too concerned about an industry that makes 110,000,000 in profits even though people loosing jobs in record shops, and cd pressing plants (if that happens) isnt very nice i suppose. i can see that downloading may have a bigger negative impact on smaller independant labels, then again you rarely hear these people complaining and trying to get the law to crack down on teenagers.

 

[piratio]

but I would have thought that a person who doesn't own any albums would be just as much a laughing stock among the music fans of the world as someone who cites a greatest hits collection as their favourite album of all time. You see - peer pressure can be a force for good too.

My Cd collection numbers around 60 now, where it used to be about 200-odd... I have 4500+ albums on MP3. I'm not ashamed of it, in terms of it's authenticity. I think that kind of thinking is out-dated really when it comes to music collections. I also haven't paid for the vast majority of it. When I can pay for it, I do. That might make me a criminal, but I certainly don't feel I am doing harm to any major label bands.

Counter to this, I also run a web label which gives away music for free and actively encourages musicians to go it alone. Indeed, at the moment, we're building a new resource for an entirely DIY approach to the 'industry'. This will cover the basics of creative commons and the basics of other legal issues, technical aspects of music distribution, promotion, gig organisation, etc, and how to use the internet/social software to their best.

The one thing that the industry refuses to accept is that huge numbers of people are asking for, through the action of 'pirating', freely available media. As long as they refuse to budge, people will keep doing what they want. The Radiohead model is a move towards that place, but it can't work across the board - they were able to take that risk based on a secure fanbase and a minimal spend [they already owned a studio, paid for by previous releases and they own the servers used to distribute the mp3s] Napster, P2P and MySpace et al, proves that people can go it alone, so what's the problem?

 

[Vinnie]

It's very easy to justify never paying for music when it's painted as enlightened digital utopia art commune versus billionaire luddite major label hell on earth.

 

[egg_]

Napster, P2P and MySpace et al, proves that people can go it alone, so what's the problem?

The problem is it looks like soon that you won't be able to make a living out of being a recording artist. I don't think that would be a good thing, primarily because I think there would be less good recorded music available as a result - obviously I don't believe that you have to be doing it for a living to do it well, but I'm pretty sure my own composition would improve vastly if I had the chance to do it fulltime, and I expect it's the same for everyone

 

[aoboa]

The problem is it looks like soon that you won't be able to make a living out of being a recording artist. I don't think that would be a good thing, primarily because I think there would be less good recorded music available as a result - obviously I don't believe that you have to be doing it for a living to do it well, but I'm pretty sure my own composition would improve vastly if I had the chance to do it fulltime, and I expect it's the same for everyone

I'd say .00000000000000000000001% of musicians make a living out of being recording artists and I'd say almost all of those who do spent years gigging their asses off.

 

[broken arm]

was there ever a heyday of loads of artists making a living from recording music?

you need to get a plumber in for your pipedreams lads.

 

[Vinnie]

was there ever a heyday of loads of artists making a living from recording music?

There was just about to be but then filesharing came along. There was literally hours in the difference.

 

[broken arm]

There was just about to be but then filesharing came along. There was literally hours in the difference.

i wandered lonely as a cloud

 

[Mormon Nailer]

The problem is it looks like soon that you won't be able to make a living out of being a recording artist. I don't think that would be a good thing, primarily because I think there would be less good recorded music available as a result - obviously I don't believe that you have to be doing it for a living to do it well, but I'm pretty sure my own composition would improve vastly if I had the chance to do it fulltime, and I expect it's the same for everyone

I don't think the outlook for the artist is that bleak - it is for the recording companies but I'd be more hopeful for the artist.

Look at it this way - are you more or less likely to make a living from music with or without a parasitical middle man between you and the consumer?

 

[Unicron]

The problem is it looks like soon that you won't be able to make a living out of being a recording artist. I don't think that would be a good thing, primarily because I think there would be less good recorded music available as a result - obviously I don't believe that you have to be doing it for a living to do it well, but I'm pretty sure my own composition would improve vastly if I had the chance to do it fulltime, and I expect it's the same for everyone

Presumably you'd be gigging fulltime as well though dude.

 

[Lili Marlene]

I bought Daphne and Celeste's album cos I couldn't find it anywhere to download,

true story