Legal shit (1 Viewer)

[Goodbye]

What are the legal ramifications to quoting lyrics of someone else's song in your own, even though they are an all to obvious and easily recognizable homage to the song they are quoting from.

Story.

 

[the departed]

id say the same rule applies as does to anything else..

like, if youre quoting prince....

your ass will end up in court!


hmm.

 

[Goodbye]

No. Not Prince.

Lets say it was the words to Happy Birthday.
And as a homage to the song, I used a line from it in one of my own songs cos I like it so much, and then carried on with my own lyrics, having let everyone know I did Happy Birthday so much I referenced it in one of my songs.

I know Spiritualized used I Cant Help Falling In Love With You at the start of Ladies and Gentlemen... and had to change it before release.
I heard an advance copy at the time, and he sang the song with the same melody also.

In my case: I'm not using the same melody, just the same words for one line.

Do I need permission? Anyone?

 

[Jill Hives]

Not sure of the legal ramifications but others have done it before. Casiotone for the Painfully Alone have a song called, 'Toby, Take a Bow' that's filled with Smiths lyrics.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

 

[the departed]

is happy birthday in the public domain?

NO
http://www.snopes.com/music/songs/birthday.asp

 

[Goodbye]

Happy Birthday was just my ironic example. duh.

 

[Goodbye]

Not sure of the legal ramifications but others have done it before. Casiotone for the Painfully Alone have a song called, 'Toby, Take a Bow' that's filled with Smiths lyrics.

YouTube - Casiotone for the Painfully Alone, "Toby Take A Bow"

aww. thats wuvley

 

[Goff]

Copyright laws apply. Just don't use more than six words in a row and you might get away with it. You can, of course, reference a song title in another song.

 

[pissypants]

If you're going to use the original words or music, or both,
you got to pay the piper, or risk the consequences.

For example, Robbie Williams apparently paraphrased a few lines of a Loudain Wainwright song on his last album. The resultant lawsuit cost him a huge chunk of change in damages claimed by the copyright owner, and exisiting copies of the album had to be withdrawn, and new lyrics re-recorded.

In a case like this the artist who's lyrics are copied can pretty much name their sum, as they are claiming "damages".

You can get away with it though if it's considered a parody (I don't think a "tribute" cuts it) but you'd have to change the words.

Was it the 2live crew who got away with "Oh Pretty Woman" a near copy of Roy Orbison's "Pretty Woman" on the grounds that it was a parody?

I can't remember the artist, but there was a case in the 90's where an artist lost a case based around the use of 3 consecutive melodic notes. Crazy but true. Copyright is also not based on the number of consecutive words used.

That said, many publishing companies have an online application form for appyling for use of a song so actually applying is easy enough. The likelihood though is that they'll want a cash advance based on projected sales (their expectation, not yours!) that is going to scupper the whole thing.

Or you could just change the lyric for the recording and do it whatever way you want to live.

 

[Goff]

I



I can't remember the artist, but there was a case in the 90's where an artist lost a case based around the use of 3 consecutive melodic notes. Crazy but true. Copyright is also not based on the number of consecutive words used.

I think that was based on a sample. Not on consecutive notes as such. Considering there aren't that many notes to play around with, it would be madness. You're right re the consecutive words thing. I think it's more to do with intent, or some other such legalese.

 

[pissypants]

I think that was based on a sample. Not on consecutive notes as such. Considering there aren't that many notes to play around with, it would be madness. You're right re the consecutive words thing. I think it's more to do with intent, or some other such legalese.

Yeah I'm trying to remember the specifics on this one. Thing is, if it was a sample I'm sure it would have been a cut and dry "you used our sound recording" thingy, but yes, it is mad, and yes, i think there was probably some other aspect involved. Something contextual. I don't think it was even a "soundalike" version . God I wish I could remember. I remember it being used a few times as an example of an extreme ruling, so it could have been just a mad judge or something. There was definitely a boyband of some kind involved....

And the same for the lyrics, I don't think anyone could ever copyright a random phrase like "This is the last time" or ""I love you" as part of a song, it's kind of a grey area, as you say, based on context.

(Frank Zappa tried to copytright the phrase "freak out")

 

[coast to coast]

Animal Collective also had to change the original version of Purple Bottle from Feels - there's a white label I believe called the Stevie Wonder version cos it I has the lines "I just called to say I loved you" - subsequently changed to "I wanna tell you that you are the purple in me..."

I think the Spiritualized guys got away with it under the claim that the lines were a kind of folk idiom ("Wise men say only fools rush in, but I can't help falling in love with you....").

I think Beta Band also got into some kind of dispute over a song on their debut album which had a line "Once upon a time I was falling apart now I'm always falling in love..." - Jim Steinmen got on his high horse about it.

I have no legal advice. Surely if you aren't making any money from it yourself, its difficult to get money from you, because they'd only be taking from money generated by the song, right? You don't have to pay someone to perform a cover basically I mean.

Alternatively you could just write to said artist or said artist's estate.

 

[pissypants]

Surely if you aren't making any money from it yourself, its difficult to get money from you, because they'd only be taking from money generated by the song, right?

As it's "damages" it's not based on units sold. Although I'm sure it must be a difference in the ruling based on whether you've sold 20 or 20,000 copies as to the "damage" done to the artist.

You don't have to pay someone to perform a cover basically I mean.

Performance royalties are paid by the venue you play your music in under their payments to IMRO. It's different from a recording. Like the difference between slander and libel.

 

[Jill Hives]

Animal Collective also had to change the original version of Purple Bottle from Feels - there's a white label I believe called the Stevie Wonder version cos it I has the lines "I just called to say I loved you" - subsequently changed to "I wanna tell you that you are the purple in me..."

Interesting. That's the only song I ever heard that I liked by them. Oddly too because it never made sense to me and the purple bit always bugged me.

 

[ogy]

yeh the sample thing was the beastie boys i think

the white stripes have a tune where all the lyrics are made from lines from the citizen kane script, and they got sued i think.

 

[Goodbye]

fuck it anyway

 

[the departed]

fuck it anyway

look, just buy the rights to happy birthday and youll be fine.

 

[coast to coast]

As it's "damages" it's not based on units sold. Although I'm sure it must be a difference in the ruling based on whether you've sold 20 or 20,000 copies as to the "damage" done to the artist.



Performance royalties are paid by the venue you play your music in under their payments to IMRO. It's different from a recording. Like the difference between slander and libel.

Oh right. Clearly I don't know what I'm talking about! Didn't realise that.

 

[Pantone247]

Spiritulized had to cut the line in the end

they do it live, and it was on promo versions

but on the album it's cut

I remember the Beta band thing, I think they took a bath on it, giving Steinman mad crazy royalties, or cutting the line... I was only listening to that song today and I actually can't remember...

BUT I only reaslied the other day that Alison's Starting To Happen off Shame About Ray by Lemonheads has the line

"It's so mesmerising, can't describe it, all that inside stuff"

which is the spoken word 'freaky' bit from Rocks Off on Exile In Mainstreet, by the extremely litigious Rolling Stones... it's pretty cleverly done and broken up over a couple of lines, but is cleary a word for word lift

so to summerise, I have no new information or opinons on this subject, but I know a lot of useless stuff about pop music

 

[Goodbye]

Thanks Panty
first post I read today
Utter utter disappointment
Shudda gone to the I Have The Horn For Thread instead