You know you're getting old.... (1 Viewer)

nuke terrorist

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some thoughts as far as music innovation goes:

the folks credited as the first wave of 'free improvisors in the 60's needed no new tech to simply start playing on intuition. although of course that helped.

when BLUE CHEER started they were a 6 piece (inc. Vale later of Search and Destroy / RE:Search fame)
when they saw circa 1967 how loud the new Marshall amps were, they ditched 3 guys and became a trio.
a big change from not being able to hear the BEATLES in a theatre a few years earlier.

a few things happened at times that made a huge difference:
in the late 70's the arrival of affordable home recording, synths and the rapid development of the independent scene (distribution, tape trading, zines, DIY culture...) meant an avalanche of new music ideas.
people had access to getting their music heard and long distance communication that was extremely rare before.

one of my points is how old a lot of cornerstones of music are now.

Remix culture goes back at least to KING TUBBY in 1971.
DJing in hip hop started with KOOL HERC in 1973 and more experimental turntablism someone like CHRISTIAN MARCLAY in the late 70's.
sampling has been a huge part of rap and house other urban music since the mid 80's.
atonal western classical music started w/ SCHOENBERG in 1900.

it's a combo of people and what equipment they have access to at the time.
if someone in 1965 had heard Astronomy Domine or Purple Haze it would have probably sounded far into the future - not 18 months.

not sure what I am trying to say but developments happen at a slower rate now.

mutation is a great word. in biology they are mostly bad but a good one is evolution changing for a species.
 

Cornu Ammonis

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in biology they are mostly bad
Incorrect! Most mutations are benign and everything in your body is a product of mutation.

But taking your example of evolution, what you’re describing in music is similar to punctuated equilibrium in evolution. The idea is that evolution happens very slowly but there are periods where evolution seems to happen really quickly with lots of new species formed. I think it’s just a trait of a complex system (which music on a societal level pretty much is).
 

Benny Cake

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some thoughts as far as music innovation goes:

the folks credited as the first wave of 'free improvisors in the 60's needed no new tech to simply start playing on intuition. although of course that helped.

when BLUE CHEER started they were a 6 piece (inc. Vale later of Search and Destroy / RE:Search fame)
when they saw circa 1967 how loud the new Marshall amps were, they ditched 3 guys and became a trio.
a big change from not being able to hear the BEATLES in a theatre a few years earlier.

a few things happened at times that made a huge difference:
in the late 70's the arrival of affordable home recording, synths and the rapid development of the independent scene (distribution, tape trading, zines, DIY culture...) meant an avalanche of new music ideas.
people had access to getting their music heard and long distance communication that was extremely rare before.

one of my points is how old a lot of cornerstones of music are now.

Remix culture goes back at least to KING TUBBY in 1971.
DJing in hip hop started with KOOL HERC in 1973 and more experimental turntablism someone like CHRISTIAN MARCLAY in the late 70's.
sampling has been a huge part of rap and house other urban music since the mid 80's.
atonal western classical music started w/ SCHOENBERG in 1900.

it's a combo of people and what equipment they have access to at the time.
if someone in 1965 had heard Astronomy Domine or Purple Haze it would have probably sounded far into the future - not 18 months.

not sure what I am trying to say but developments happen at a slower rate now.

mutation is a great word. in biology they are mostly bad but a good one is evolution changing for a species.
Where are you getting this idea that synths were affordable in the late 70s? They were incredibly expensive. A Roland SH 1000 would set you back a grand, which is nearly $5000 in today’s money, and that’s entry level.

I think you’re actually making a rather elitist argument without realizing it.
 
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Cornu Ammonis

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Where are you getting this idea that synths were affordable in the late 70s? They were incredibly expensive. A Roland SH 1000 would set you back a grand, which is nearly $5000 in today’s money, and that’s entry level.

I think you’re actually making a rather elitist argument without realizing it.
There were cheaper synths (like the Wasp) which were the foundation of the industrial/post-punk scene. They couldn’t do what the big modulars could do and they weren’t that reliable but they allowed people into the space to make music.
 

nuke terrorist

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Where are you getting this idea that synths were affordable in the late 70s? They were incredibly expensive. A Roland SH 1000 would set you back a grand, which is nearly $5000 in today’s money, and that’s entry level.

I think you’re actually making a rather elitist argument without realizing it.

EDIT: mixed up a Roland SH and Roland SH 1000 - sorry END EDIT.
in 1978 wiki says a Korg MS-20 cost $750, which is more what I meant.

yeah Benny - not cheap. but a synth cost many times that a few years earlier in the 70's.
another much cheaper option was home made synth kits you had to solder together.

I did a quick google search and a Strat guitar cost $600 in 1977. but of course you could get a guitar
for £50 to start with.

about 1979/80 a Fairlight sampler cost up to 50,000 and Synclavier cost maybe 200,000???
ball park figures there.

also worth pointing out that there was a lot of talk in the early 1990's about people making music on computers in their bedrooms.
but my guess is that it would have taken 6 months wages then for me to buy the equipment to make a techno record at home. I would have been unimpressed at somebody saying this was accessible or DIY.
but in both cases it was compared to before.
 
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pete

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also worth pointing out that there was a lot of talk in the early 1990's about people making music on computers in their bedrooms.
but my guess is that it would have taken 6 months wages then for me to buy the equipment to make a techno record at home. I would have been unimpressed at somebody saying this was accessible or DIY.
but in both cases it was compared to before.
the Atari ST was reasonably affordable and found a life as a very popular home studio midi controller, but you still needed all the Midi gear of course

the real bedroom composers were working in trackers on an Amiga 500



 

nuke terrorist

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the Atari ST was reasonably affordable and found a life as a very popular home studio midi controller, but you still needed all the Midi gear of course

the real bedroom composers were working in trackers on an Amiga 500




holy shit that looks complicated! and sounds terrible.
I hate the Yamaha DX7. ruined 80's music (first mass selling digital synth launched 1983. cost £1,500. I prefer analog synths)

out of interest Pete could you put a price on this?
I seem to remember an Amiga costing about £600 circa 1991.

in 1992 a friend of mine with well off parents got a camcorder for Xmas . £700!
I would've had to work a whole summer to get that kind of money.

another friend had rich grandparents.... he and his highly irresponsible father got the idea to ask them to pay for gear to open a recording studio. but he mostly wanted it for themselves to mess around with. I though no way will the grandparents be this naive.
next they got the guts of £10k and they had a 32 track console and loads of other gear.

a computer w/ Windows 98 would have cost over £1,500 in 1998.
that would be about 3,000 Euro now.

I (b. 1975) never earned over £75 a week as a teen.

I suppose the biggest problem now is not the price of gear but finding a practice room.
 

GO

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I love that Amiga tracker music . Piracy music.

Also the DX7 is a great instrument!

The drummer in my teenage band had an Atari ST with cubase and a couple of midi modules .. I was super envious . I managed to borrow it a few times. It was amazing .My brother had an Amiga but all we did with that was play Sensible Soccer
 

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