Tour de France 2007 thread (4 Viewers)

[nofriendo]

pattachi is out!

 

[rettucs]

Ok, so all Postal riders were doped. But, like, so were most riders. Once in a while you hear about clean riders, but they are really the exception to the rule. Chris Boardman was clean. As was Obree. I would say Millar is clean now. Pretty much all of the rest weren't.
Catching one rider, and making a pariah of him makes me sick, because they all do it, and they basically have no choice.
The team runs the doping programs, not the riders. The team take kids, and basically force them to dope. Then one gets caught say, and its pack your bags time.

Put yourself in their position. All riders are doping around you. You have to ride to survive. You have minimal education. You have next to no chance to go to college. You have dedicated your life to riding. Your doctor is anxious to start you on The Program. Everyone in the team is sitting around, looking at you, showing no ill effects of any sort. You are having a hard time with the winter training. You allow them to start you on a small bit and everything is doable again.

It's almost like blaming a racehorse for being doped.

I'd be of the inclination to almost always blame the team and doctors too, and not the riders. In Armstrong's case though, he was the team. In fact he was bigger than the team. I think he knew full well what he was at.

I was a huge fan of the man for years. But I don't believe for a second that he was anything other than doped to the gills, as he continuously claims.

 

[rettucs]

pattachi is out!

yep, tested positive at the Giro, where he won 5 stages.

shame. His presence will really be missed.

Wait and see the new shining British hope in the sprints. Mark Cavendish. Now that Pettachi is out, there'll be more chance of him taking stages. McEwen is still the man to beat though (and maybe Benatti)

 

[flashback]

I'd be of the inclination to almost always blame the team and doctors too, and not the riders. In Armstrong's case though, he was the team. In fact he was bigger than the team. I think he knew full well what he was at.

I was a huge fan of the man for years. But I don't believe for a second that he was anything other than doped to the gills, as he continuously claims.

Right.
Right.

yep, tested positive at the Giro, where he won 5 stages.

shame. His presence will really be missed.

Wait and see the new shining British hope in the sprints. Mark Cavendish. Now that Pettachi is out, there'll be more chance of him taking stages. McEwen is still the man to beat though (and maybe Benatti)

Right.
Right.
Right.

I completely agree with you.
McEwen is a bit of a legend in fairness. If you watch him, a lot of the time he doesn't even use his own team as his lead in. Then he just appears half way into an astonishing jump... when it matters.
Cipo was a monster, and Abdu too, total power merchants blowing people away. McEwen though... he sort of cracks me up, he is such a cheeky bastard.


...

 

[IFF]

I dont really think that the idea that the Yanks have some sort of monopoly on drugs is true.
Landis was one of the good guys in the Peleton by the way. A really nice guy. Not that it matters that much, but, of anyone to be caught, its sad that it was him.

i read many an interview with the guy (before he was caught) and in my opinion, he never ever came off as likeable

Vinikourov has said this will be his second to last year as a pro, and he wants to ride his last year as tour de France champion. He'll be going all out. Astana have a hell of a team. If they select Mazolleni, Klodeon, Kasheckin to help him, its difficult enough to see past him winning alright.

Massoleni's not in it, out due to the coni investigation into the oil for drugs scandal of 2004 where dani,lo di luca is also being investigated

 

[flashback]

i read many an interview with the guy (before he was caught) and in my opinion, he never ever came off as likeable

My mate's sister worked with him for a long while, and said he was a lovely bloke.

 

[rettucs]

McEwen though... he sort of cracks me up, he is such a cheeky bastard.
...

yep, you have to admire the balls of the man. Doesn't care about decorum or etiquette. Doesn't care what people think of him. Hes just a pure savage of a sprinter. I think him better than Pettachi at the moment anyway, and reckon he'd be top man for the green jersey regardless. Actually, Pettachi probably would have been packed up and gone by the time they hit the big climbs.

Anyway, this starts tomorrow. Bring it on.

 

[rettucs]

i read many an interview with the guy (before he was caught) and in my opinion, he never ever came off as likeable

Massoleni's not in it, out due to the coni investigation into the oil for drugs scandal of 2004 where dani,lo di luca is also being investigated

I don't think likeable was ever the issue with Landis. He was never much of a 'yes-man', and for that reason he fell out with Armstrong. That would have turned a lot of the American public against him. He always struck me, outwardly at least, as a humble sort of a chap, and certainly likeable. Just maybe not necessarily someone I'd like to have as a support man if I was a team leader.

Shame about Mazzolini. He had a great Giro. And he has a lovely burd too!! (Elisha Basso, sister of the bould Ivan - google pics her for a look. A fine thing). Salvodelli is in there though. Astana are going to be very strong in the hills.

Valverde is lucky enough to be able to take the start. He was implicated in the Puerto scandal as they found a blood bag with the name of his dog on it. He denied owning a dog though, and investigators couldn't find the dog, or any evidence that he ever owned a dog. One wonders what came of the poor mutt!!

 

[nuke terrorist]

the investigation that Di Luca and Mazzoleni are part related to raids that took place at the 2004 Giro labelled 'Oil For Drugs'.
eight riders on the race had their hotel rooms and homes searched, plus Di Luca's home ( I don't think he was on the race).
this was part of a huge coordinated anti doping search across Italy. All the riders worked with the same doctor.

one of the riders Alessio Galetti died of a heart attack during a race in Spain in June 2005 aged 37.

 

[flashback]

Robbie McEwen bounced back from a late crash to win the first full stage of the Tour de France after an enthralling bunch sprint in Canterbury.

Unreal.
Crashes three miles from the end of the race, wins race. Even by his standards... thats pretty good going.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/6282326.stm

 

[nofriendo]

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[rettucs]

Unreal.
Crashes three miles from the end of the race, wins race. Even by his standards... thats pretty good going.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/6282326.stm

It actually played into his hands in a way. The others weren't watching out for him as they assumed he hadn't caught up. Then when he made his move it looked like he came out of nowhere. Amazing finish.

Contrast to coolness of McEwen to the hissy fit Cavendish threw when he had a mechanical before the last climb. He has a bit to learn yet does the young lad.

 

[flashback]

Hard not to feel for Cavendish though... would have been a nice start to his Tour career, and he would have gotten up into the gallop at least.

All of a sudden I am liking UK riders, I am really happy to see Millar back. He is a great rider, and he came very close to going off the rails altogether there for a while, with the drink and depression and things.

 

[nuke terrorist]

old news but...
when Kloeden beat everyones time in the prologue by ten seconds ( more at that point )
I found it difficult to credit, then Cancellara wins by an additional 13 seconds - what are you supposed to think? I've never seen a prologue won by such a margin and 23 seconds back to third place is incredible.
Bradley Wiggins rode near as well as could but was beaten by that margin he did everything he could except put a syringe in his arm.
Cancellara works with Cecchini who was the doctor of Basso , Ullrich and Hamilton and Kloeden complained about having to sign the anti doping charter and left T-MOBILE because he was part of the Ullrich clique which also included his pal Kessler.

 

[rettucs]

old news but...
when Kloeden beat everyones time in the prologue by ten seconds ( more at that point )
I found it difficult to credit, then Cancellara wins by an additional 13 seconds - what are you supposed to think? I've never seen a prologue won by such a margin and 23 seconds back to third place is incredible.
Bradley Wiggins rode near as well as could but was beaten by that margin he did everything he could except put a syringe in his arm.
Cancellara works with Cecchini who was the doctor of Basso , Ullrich and Hamilton and Kloeden complained about having to sign the anti doping charter and left T-MOBILE because he was part of the Ullrich clique which also included his pal Kessler.

yep, and Vinikourov works with Ferarri, but claims he's his trainer, not his doctor.

your cynicism is well placed. Kloden has laid down a big marker for this year's tour already and Astana may yet abandon the Vino card and go with Kloden as the main man (though I doubt it - the Khazak connection and that).

Theres still a long way to go. We'll hear more of this no doubt during that time.

 

[rettucs]

Hard not to feel for Cavendish though... would have been a nice start to his Tour career, and he would have gotten up into the gallop at least.

All of a sudden I am liking UK riders, I am really happy to see Millar back. He is a great rider, and he came very close to going off the rails altogether there for a while, with the drink and depression and things.

young riders tend to have that impetuousness about them though. They lack self-discipline and their impatience can be their undoing. He needs to bide his time and I'm sure he'll get his win.

Yesterday's finish was something else. Boonen's lead-out man 'forgot' to slow up and ended up taking the stage from him. I'm sure harsh words were had on their team bus afterwards.

Amazing crash 3km out too. What a sight to see all the riders sitting up on their bikes looking back at the big screen to watch the finish. The crash seemed to be caused by a Milram rider who ended up staying upright himself, but took about 30 lads out. Some walking wounded by the looks of it, including Cancellara.

 

[flashback]

young riders tend to have that impetuousness about them though. They lack self-discipline and their impatience can be their undoing. He needs to bide his time and I'm sure he'll get his win.

oh yeah.
It's definitely a case of "Welcome to cycling. It's not fair." No problem learning that lesson.

Boonen's lead-out man 'forgot' to slow up and ended up taking the stage from him. I'm sure harsh words were had on their team bus afterwards.

Now that I have little enough sympathy for. Boonen's guy cant sit up too much, we were always told the lead out goes out like he wants the sprint, and Boonen should be coming through like a train. That Steegmans guy did his job perfectly, Boonen fucked up. Boonen forgot about his own dude, he probably didn't even see him in his mind since he had his eye out for everyone else.

 

[IFF]

Yesterday's finish was something else. Boonen's lead-out man 'forgot' to slow up and ended up taking the stage from him

reminds me of the TTT in the giro when gasparotto crossed the line first for liquigas and you could see di luca yelling at him

happy for steegmans. he's given up a few victories in the past when he was deffinately going to win. This season in one race for Boonen and last season a few times when he was lead out man for mcewen

he's a pick of mine in a fantasy team for a lanterne rouge competition where we pick 10 riders and hope they get the bottom 10 places.

 

[rettucs]

I wouldn't hold my breath on Boonen finishing. Once McEwen gets his teeth into that green jersey I can't see it moving again.

Yesterday's stage was a dull as hell. It was if they made a pact not to race until the last 40km, probably because of the crash the day before.

Even the lads up the road were riding in the small ring and weren't trying to pull out any more of a gap. Its mad when stuff like that happens.

When they became a group of 4 things looked promising for them, but once they started attacking each other in the last 10km they were always gonna get pissed off with each other and start looking at each other. I hate seeing breakaways getting caught with the finish line in sight, but thats what they get for pricking around.

Poor ol' David Millar lost his KOM jersey. I wonder will we see him at all any more? Maybe in a break or 2, but I can't see him mixing it with the big guns in the big hills.

Whats with these new electronic shifters? How do they work I wonder? Whats wrong with a good old fashioned campag record or shimano dura-ace shifter?

 

[flashback]

Whats with these new electronic shifters? How do they work I wonder? Whats wrong with a good old fashioned campag record or shimano dura-ace shifter?

I won a sprint because I was using the STI shifters and the other lad was on old fashioned ones... wait wait wait, drops hand to change gear, -CHUNK-, later.
I dunno. I heard they would be using these shifters, Mavic had electric ones years ago but were a bit crap.
They probably work now, and weigh less than the STI guys.

The old trick was cruise past someone on a climb, and push their shifter all the way down so they change into the smallest sprocket.

That really hurts.