The Cosmic Right (1 Viewer)

seanc

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It's interesting taking all this apart. I do find myself questioning things that I took for granted. But all in all, I've not seen anything close to convincing from these people.


I knew a few conspiracy theorists before all this Covid stuff. But what they all had in common was they all took a lot of synthetic cheap drugs. It's hard watching people you know and like and respect falling into this conspiracy hole. At least I know who my friends are now I suppose.
 

David Kronenbourg

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It's interesting taking all this apart. I do find myself questioning things that I took for granted. But all in all, I've not seen anything close to convincing from these people.


I knew a few conspiracy theorists before all this Covid stuff. But what they all had in common was they all took a lot of synthetic cheap drugs. It's hard watching people you know and like and respect falling into this conspiracy hole. At least I know who my friends are now I suppose.
Yeah one of my good friends is now s full on trump supporting anti-vaxxer. He only went down this road in the last few years.
 

sleepy

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It's interesting taking all this apart. I do find myself questioning things that I took for granted. But all in all, I've not seen anything close to convincing from these people.


I knew a few conspiracy theorists before all this Covid stuff. But what they all had in common was they all took a lot of synthetic cheap drugs. It's hard watching people you know and like and respect falling into this conspiracy hole. At least I know who my friends are now I suppose.
This person never took drugs afaik. Don’t think they even smoked weed. They got involved with the water charges movement a few years back, which transitioned to general anti government anger, then on to chemtrails and fluoride conspiracies before arriving at their current political stance
 

seanc

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Yeah I know, that's my point. I could forgive my deadhead mates for their foolishness because their brains are mashed up from skunk and shit speed and dodgy mdma.

But now we're seeing otherwise sensible people falling into these conspiracy holes. tbh I saw it years ago when people were shocked at European muslims heading off to Syria. Before that with the London bombings by those lads from Slough. I said "all these people have just spent months sitting at home watching youtube, and they got radicalised".

I've said it before, it's because people don't develop critical thinking faculties at school. And they don't really know how the internet works. They think teh internets is real life. So they get easy to radicalise. Obviously lockdown hasn't helped.

At this point I'd like to thank Thumped for teaching me that the internet is for pricks. That's a genuine thanks. Hard lessons, but I learned 'em.
 

sleepy

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Yeah I know, that's my point. I could forgive my deadhead mates for their foolishness because their brains are mashed up from skunk and shit speed and dodgy mdma.

But now we're seeing otherwise sensible people falling into these conspiracy holes. tbh I saw it years ago when people were shocked at European muslims heading off to Syria. Before that with the London bombings by those lads from Slough. I said "all these people have just spent months sitting at home watching youtube, and they got radicalised".

I've said it before, it's because people don't develop critical thinking faculties at school. And they don't really know how the internet works. They think teh internets is real life. So they get easy to radicalise. Obviously lockdown hasn't helped.

At this point I'd like to thank Thumped for teaching me that the internet is for pricks. That's a genuine thanks. Hard lessons, but I learned 'em.
I’m not sure I would have called this person otherwise sensible…..
 

seanc

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Ah yes, besides the shitty party drugs, there is also the steroids and testosterone. Brehvik liked his steroids apparently. That stuff definitely messes your head up.

I think this was covered over on the wrestling thread.
 

snakybus

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I spent some time recently with some very nice people who are what I would call mildly new-agey. As in, no dreads or drugs or crystals or bokcetty vans. Instead, proper jobs, alternative healing and health and organic food and so on.

A conversation ensued about the evils of smart phones which I'm down with of course, but then segued to the "your phone is listening to you" debate, which I'm not. My point was that, as a conspiracy theory, while it feels believable, a sensible person will not find it difficult to poke holes in. My setup was as follows:

1. You have condition X (stiff joints, heartburn) or specific interest Y (acoustic guitars, alternative medicine).
2. You are talking about it to someone.
3. You go on Facebook and an ad that is specifically about this - and maybe even a product you mentioned in your conversation - appears in Facebook.

Obviously, the way most people would react is that they'd go "Woah! My phone is listening to me!" Which is what these people said was the case.

I mentioned that I woke up in the middle of the night recently with heartburn and went to get a particular product in the bathroom which has been sitting there unused for eight years as I had bought it for my wife who was pregnant with our son. She didn't use it so there it sat. And in my pain I saw it and went "That'll do!".

The next day ads popped up in my Facebook for this very product.

Now: they took this as proof that my phone is listening to me/watching me. So I moved to the next bit, the logical bit.

I said "It's not, don't you see? It was the middle of the night, it was dark, and my phone was in the next room." They replied "How do you know? Even when your phone is off, it's still on." Despite the fact that I know a certain amount about analytics, having worked a little in it, I didn't get into that side because frankly I was feeling a bit like that would go nowhere fast and I was going from smug logician to some bollix with his flute out trying to piss up a drain. So I simply said that it would need to be able to see in the dark, and also, with my phone lying flat, it can only see the ceiling. It would need a periscope abilities to see what I was doing. How could it see the crumpled box I bought eight years ago and never mentioned again, in the next room. But all they could talk about was the CIA monitoring us through our Samsung TVs.

I eventually said that it's much more likely that as a 48 year old (which analytics knows) who ordered spicy pizza recently (which analytics knows) is probably going to have heartburn and is probably going to go for this particular brand. I could have mentioned that there are also lots of ads on Facebook that AREN'T relevant to me, and that this time, this ad got lucky, but things were getting awkward and they had just given me lots of beer.

My parallel point, which I think I made -- but beer -- is that there's also the issue that every daw-brain who sees this will think "guh, I DO have athlete's todger, these fuckers know what I'm up to!" So... the ultra-secret evildoers are kind of being obvious, dontcha think? Unless the CIA wants to implant mind-manipulation stuff in our heartburn pills and Nike runners.

Anyway I guess my point was that things can easily LOOK like one thing but a bit logic will easily prove otherwise. And in this case, the coincidence was so easily proven beyond reasonable doubt to be NOT "your phone is watching you" and down to the more complicated idea of data analytics and Internet activity that it was a no-brainer. But I failed. They wouldn't believe me! Given boring logic on one side and admittedly much cooler crazy shit on the other, crazy shit won!

So that's that. I think I'll start a religion and make a few quid. Fuck it, like.
 

sleepy

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I spent some time recently with some very nice people who are what I would call mildly new-agey. As in, no dreads or drugs or crystals or bokcetty vans. Instead, proper jobs, alternative healing and health and organic food and so on.

A conversation ensued about the evils of smart phones which I'm down with of course, but then segued to the "your phone is listening to you" debate, which I'm not. My point was that, as a conspiracy theory, while it feels believable, a sensible person will not find it difficult to poke holes in. My setup was as follows:

1. You have condition X (stiff joints, heartburn) or specific interest Y (acoustic guitars, alternative medicine).
2. You are talking about it to someone.
3. You go on Facebook and an ad that is specifically about this - and maybe even a product you mentioned in your conversation - appears in Facebook.

Obviously, the way most people would react is that they'd go "Woah! My phone is listening to me!" Which is what these people said was the case.

I mentioned that I woke up in the middle of the night recently with heartburn and went to get a particular product in the bathroom which has been sitting there unused for eight years as I had bought it for my wife who was pregnant with our son. She didn't use it so there it sat. And in my pain I saw it and went "That'll do!".

The next day ads popped up in my Facebook for this very product.

Now: they took this as proof that my phone is listening to me/watching me. So I moved to the next bit, the logical bit.

I said "It's not, don't you see? It was the middle of the night, it was dark, and my phone was in the next room." They replied "How do you know? Even when your phone is off, it's still on." Despite the fact that I know a certain amount about analytics, having worked a little in it, I didn't get into that side because frankly I was feeling a bit like that would go nowhere fast and I was going from smug logician to some bollix with his flute out trying to piss up a drain. So I simply said that it would need to be able to see in the dark, and also, with my phone lying flat, it can only see the ceiling. It would need a periscope abilities to see what I was doing. How could it see the crumpled box I bought eight years ago and never mentioned again, in the next room. But all they could talk about was the CIA monitoring us through our Samsung TVs.

I eventually said that it's much more likely that as a 48 year old (which analytics knows) who ordered spicy pizza recently (which analytics knows) is probably going to have heartburn and is probably going to go for this particular brand. I could have mentioned that there are also lots of ads on Facebook that AREN'T relevant to me, and that this time, this ad got lucky, but things were getting awkward and they had just given me lots of beer.

My parallel point, which I think I made -- but beer -- is that there's also the issue that every daw-brain who sees this will think "guh, I DO have athlete's todger, these fuckers know what I'm up to!" So... the ultra-secret evildoers are kind of being obvious, dontcha think? Unless the CIA wants to implant mind-manipulation stuff in our heartburn pills and Nike runners.

Anyway I guess my point was that things can easily LOOK like one thing but a bit logic will easily prove otherwise. And in this case, the coincidence was so easily proven beyond reasonable doubt to be NOT "your phone is watching you" and down to the more complicated idea of data analytics and Internet activity that it was a no-brainer. But I failed. They wouldn't believe me! Given boring logic on one side and admittedly much cooler crazy shit on the other, crazy shit won!

So that's that. I think I'll start a religion and make a few quid. Fuck it, like.
You need to have a much simpler narrative to start a religion
 

egg_

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I read a thing lately that talked about location-based ads - that ads that people around you get influence that ads you get. Make sense I suppose, and explains a lot of the "my phone is listening to me" stuff.

Poor oul Dermot Doran is posting on facebook about the vaccine being all about connecting you to AI. I don't think non-techies have any idea of how fucking boring and mundane and non-magical real AI really is
 

snakybus

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I read a thing lately that talked about location-based ads - that ads that people around you get influence that ads you get. Make sense I suppose, and explains a lot of the "my phone is listening to me" stuff.

Poor oul Dermot Doran is posting on facebook about the vaccine being all about connecting you to AI. I don't think non-techies have any idea of how fucking boring and mundane and non-magical real AI really is
Yeah. You visit your mam, Google maps tracks you. Location analytics sync up with other analytics knows that most grannies/mams use Colgate Aulwan. And you happen to be at the supermarket now, buying stuff for your mam, because that's what sons do but also location analytics knows it, so voila, you see an ad for Colgate Aulwan. You buy it and strengthen the case for the next poor eejit to think it's all magic.
 

ann post

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I don't think non-techies have any idea of how fucking boring and mundane and non-magical real AI really is
I dunno

Of course the backend is boring, but the A.I. powering youtube suggested content to my mind while just being a overly complicated digital watch on one hand, is still in that context more than our minds can adapt to.

I mean like all its gonna be doing is seeing that 70% of people watched A, then B the whole way through and suggests that to the people watching A or B - but the responsibilty for the bombarment, propaganda style hasn't been really teased out.
 

magicbastarder

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Anyway I guess my point was that things can easily LOOK like one thing but a bit logic will easily prove otherwise. And in this case, the coincidence was so easily proven beyond reasonable doubt to be NOT "your phone is watching you" and down to the more complicated idea of data analytics and Internet activity that it was a no-brainer. But I failed. They wouldn't believe me! Given boring logic on one side and admittedly much cooler crazy shit on the other, crazy shit won!
there's also the argument that if ads served to you *didn't* ever get it right through sheer coincidence, it'd be very odd.
 

taubstumm

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It is oddly fascinating. And no, they don’t have a solution. I’m not sure if they even fully defined the problem. It just seems to be generalised contrarian anger.

the guy I know who posts all this kind of stuff was occasionally going on about how all the PCR tests were faked, and for some reason this particular point was irritating me way more than the other stuff. so I went and looked up some basic how-PCR-tests-work type of links and pushed back on him on this one particular point (and more-or-less disregarding all the other loopy stuff). anyway he’s still posting all the crazy stuff, just not about PCR tests.

not sure what conclusion to draw from it other than that we’re all fucked, I suppose. he has algorithm-brain really bad and I sort of don’t know what to do about it. I’ve started to think of it as kind of like a weird new form of alcoholism where zuckerberg makes money instead of guinness.
 

taubstumm

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here’s one of the links I fired his way — might come in handy to a couple of you if you come across people hyperventilating about PCR cycle thresholds and other similar stuff.

 

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