pride vs rte (1 Viewer)

Deadmanposting

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Related: I'm yet to come across a convincing argument as to why what Rachel Dolezal did was especially bad (aside from the fact that it was all a bit morto) that doesn't end up in something akin to TERF territory. Cancel me now lads.
I think her name is Nkechi Diallo now or something, but yeah
She's just living her truth
I remember yonks ago watching a Robert Hughes doco on Australia - Beyond The Fatal Shore, and some white lad had gone to live with the aborigines. Totally gave himself over to it.
And he's all "Best way I can describe it is you know those transsexuals, who feel they were born in the wrong body, well I feel like a black fella born in a white fella's body"
This has gotta be 20 years ago. More even.
Stuck with me nevertheless.

Can't argue with it really. Or I can't.
 

Deadmanposting

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The rugby have made women's rugby for women only I see.
The element of fairness, plus the element of actual physical safety, won the day.

Seems like organisations are starting to address what is going in in the culture.
 

Deadmanposting

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I only know her name cos she came up on Twitter the other day for some reason
She makes art now
 

rettucs

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The rugby have made women's rugby for women only I see.
The element of fairness, plus the element of actual physical safety, won the day.

Seems like organisations are starting to address what is going in in the culture.
I don't think physical safety has ever been a concern when it comes to rugby, so it can't be that.
 

Deadmanposting

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I don't think physical safety has ever been a concern when it comes to rugby, so it can't be that.

Ha!
Indeed.

I saw a few tweets from women's rugby clubs in England who aren't supportive of the move.
They took two years to come to their decision and spoke to everyone they could - according to them. Bent over backwards in their statement to mention inclusivity, but didn't see another way forward when they looked at the science.
They're reviewing it again in 2024.
 

Unicron

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The IRFU have banned trans women and will restrict participation in women's rugby to people who's birth were recorded female at birth.

The justification for it is the usual "people who have gone through male puberty have certain advantages etc."

Yet the ruling will allow individuals that are intersex or who have certain DSDs, which could confer the same advantages that are the basis for banning trans women, to play.

Seems a bit arbitrary and poorly considered.

The number of women who now will no longer be able to play the game, 2. Such a massive problem for the sport.
 

Lili Marlene

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What's considered a better solution? Just let them compete? Do they actually have some natural advantage due to originally being men that's attempting to be addressed here or is that itself all overblown?

Genuine questions.
 

Unicron

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What's considered a better solution? Just let them compete? Do they actually have some natural advantage due to originally being men that's attempting to be addressed here or is that itself all overblown?

Genuine questions.

I don't know what the perfect solution is, but I'm fairly certain that an outright ban isn't the correct one, and one which bans trans women but allows others who might have the same advantages to play is pretty dodgey.
 

ernesto

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What's considered a better solution? Just let them compete? Do they actually have some natural advantage due to originally being men that's attempting to be addressed here or is that itself all overblown?

Genuine questions.

yes they definitely have an advantage with regards to physical ability having undergone puberty as a male
 

Lili Marlene

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yes they definitely have an advantage with regards to physical ability having undergone puberty as a male
Of which there are two in this sport in all of Ireland. Hmm. I mean, hysteria genuinely seems to be the right term here.

I suppose when you get into worldwide elite athlete levels and it's a sport like swimming it can start to look strange when you see the lineup of the 20 finalists and the trans people really stand out... but my understanding of elite athleticism is that the entire thing is crooked and ruined by money anyway.

Hmmmmm


Best of luck everyone, I haven't a clue but when people (not on here) are starting to use phrases like "the trans question" I'm definitely not on their side.
 

Cornu Ammonis

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Of which there are two in this sport in all of Ireland. Hmm. I mean, hysteria genuinely seems to be the right term here.

I suppose when you get into worldwide elite athlete levels and it's a sport like swimming it can start to look strange when you see the lineup of the 20 finalists and the trans people really stand out... but my understanding of elite athleticism is that the entire thing is crooked and ruined by money anyway.

Hmmmmm


Best of luck everyone, I haven't a clue but when people (not on here) are starting to use phrases like "the trans question" I'm definitely not on their side.
Framing anything as the “*insert topic here* question” is usually a sign that you’re a prick.
 

YoungHearts

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I have many thoughts about this stuff, very much along the lines of my contributions some weeks back, but I am too warm, the definition of "hot and bothered", except to say, I continue along the path that it has to be about a balancing of rights and fairness, and that's what the experts are trying to work out, based on rigorous research. Note that we are not talking about men's sports here. That's never what we are talking about. And by *we*, I meant the general discourse, and there is a reason for that. Well actually, there may be more than one. On that rather (not so) mysterious note, I take my leave. And hope you are all doing very well amid these very heated times, both weather-wise, and topic-wise :).
 
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