Ibrahimovic vs. Ireland (1 Viewer)

[ann post]

this general decline might be a necessity in hitting a suitable soccer low i which ireland can once again ascend from to italia 90 type elations.

 

[Richie]

Sweden's team:

            Isaksson   
Lustig Granqvist  Olsson Safari 
         Elm  Kallstrom  
Larsson  Ibrahimovic  Kakaniclic 
             Hysen

Elmander's replacement Hysen plays for Gotherberg and has 8 goals in 27 games for Sweden.
Kacaniklic starting on the left is the other interesting selection.. Thought he looked impressive enough in what I've seen of him playing for Fulham, though I just read he was sent on loan to Burnley recently. Also Kallstrom is back in instead of Wernbloom. Besides that it's the same team they've had in the past few qualifiers I think.

If McCarthy is in for Whelan then that's an improvement.

 

[washingcattle]

Was chatting to a Swedish friend on twitter earlier. on the prospect of Green man-marking Ibra, "Zlatan started laughing when he was told this by the journos."

Of course he laughed. I'd laugh.

Sweden's team:

            Isaksson   
Lustig Granqvist  Olsson Safari 
         Elm  Kallstrom  
Larsson  Ibrahimovic  Kakaniclic 
             Hysen

Elmander's replacement Hysen plays for Gotherberg and has 8 goals in 27 games for Sweden.
Kacaniklic starting on the left is the other interesting selection.. Thought he looked impressive enough in what I've seen of him playing for Fulham, though I just read he was sent on loan to Burnley recently. Also Kallstrom is back in instead of Wernbloom. Besides that it's the same team they've had in the past few qualifiers I think.

If McCarthy is in for Whelan then that's an improvement.

Didn't Kakaniclic get a bad injury though ? I think I'd prefer Whelan and McCarthy in there but we'll see.

 

[Unicron]

Brady out, Walters in.

At least it isn't Keogh.

 

[washingcattle]

So injuries are gradually making our starting XI stronger ?

Proof if any was needed that Trap hasn't a fucking clue.

 

[Unicron]

Good start I have to say, McClean doing surprisingly well.

 

[Unicron]

Half time question ...

has any Irish player ever scored as many fucking incredible goals as Simon Cox has? I only saw this one for the first time today

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[Richie]

Defending well but we just don't look like scoring...

 

[7 - No tomorrow]

Happy with 0-0?

 

[Unicron]

That went better than I was hoping.

Green did surprisingly well, fair play.

 

[Richie]

I'm happy enough.. That was a very solid defensive performance, considering the inexperience of the backline and how much we'd been shitting our pants over Ibra beforehand. Coleman, Clark and Wilson could be the spine of the defence for the next 5-6 years on that showing. Fair play to Forde too, kept us in it a few times. Green did his job effectively and I hope Trap has more faith in McCarthy now. On the other hand, we had no real attacking threat, some promising moves but we never dared commit the extra man or two forward and zero shots on target tells its own story. Keane was nullified too easily, surely Trap must see that it should be Hoolahan on for 75 mins and Keane for the final 15 next time, not the other way around. Promising return to the solidity of the early Trap days and not the embarassment most people expected, so it's something to build on at least.

 

[CinnamonBoy]

True, we're shit. But we shouldn't be. Go to their Wiki. Have a look at their squad. They have no one other than Zlatan. That fat lad who scored a few for Bolton? Gimme a break. Lustig of Celtic, very average, the Olssons of Blackburn and WBA, Larsson from Sunderland....we should be on a par with these cunts.

Good analysis by me there. Should have stuck on Wes at half time instead of either Keane or Long. We could've won it.

Superb from Coleman, Forde, McCarthy. Green was good except for the couple of times he gave stupid passes to nobody. Wilson was very good. Clark was solid. McClean did well at times. Walters was ok. Looking forward to Tuesday now.

 

[Cormcolash]

Jesus, most of the team actually played well!
Wilson was great, McCarthy was great, Clark did good, Coleman did good although needs to stop trying to be too fucking clever at times, excellent performance from Forde.
We were shite up front though. McClean and Walters did what they could, Long put in a shift, Unknown Fan was fucking awful again. We really need to get the fuck rid of Unknown Fan, I've been saying it for ages now, he is old and shite these days. Ever since he went to America he has been off the pace.
Green was okay defensively, fair enough, but fucking non-existant going forward. The reason we had nothing to offer up front is that Green pretty much didn't go past the half-way line, and Unknown Fan was just running about like a headless chicken and getting nowhere. We were much more effective on the wings but only had Long to aim at in the middle, basically. It was so much better when Hoolahan came on. Imagine if we could start with Hoolahan, McCarthy, and Foley, or something, wishful thinking.

 

[CinnamonBoy]

Long and Unknown Fan were equally shit, to be fair. It was that type of game. We had no shots on target. And our final ball was generally poor. Even from lads who played well. The best cross of the night, Long should've been on the end of it. Unknown Fan probably did more in the first half, but should've been withdrawn at half-time, he doesn't have the legs to do 90 minutes of what he had been doing. Long was basically Olsson's human spring-board for 90 minutes. Wes and Long or Wes and Robbie, that I would like to see.

 

[washingcattle]

On one hand it's easily the best we've played since Paris. On the other hand we still crawl over the half way line going forward, and retreat into our shell without actually bothering to put pressure on the ball. Which just isn't an effective method of winning football matches. Watched it in the bar where there are 3 TVs, so I got to check in with Scotland vs Wales which was a different kind of match altogether. Both poor teams, but full of attacking intent the whole time. It was so irritating to then look at us move like slugs. That was the best chance we'll get to win and put us in with a shot at qualifying. They were absolutely shite though. I watched them against England in the Euros and they were far better. They're a better side than us but they were awful last night.

We controlled it quite well at times, and once Hoolahan came on we looked fairly assured in possession they never looked like scoring in the second half in general but we didn't either. Over all it was better but it lacked ambition and imagination. If we don't learn from it and go for 5 across midfield and go out and attack Austria then it won't matter a bit because 2 points out of 6 isn't good enough.

Better but still not good enough.

 

[Cormcolash]

The issue with Long is that he is a great nuisance player, but he is not really a ball-winner in the air, he is most definitely no Niall Quinn. So every time we lump a ball forward, it is still just going to come straight back. We need someone with height if we are going to try and play that game. Stick Richard Dunne up front when he gets back. If he gets back.
We definitely need to go 5 across midfield, I don't think anyone will argue with that, or would have argued with it for the last couple of years. 4-4-2 is dead. But I don't exactly think we were slow moving forward, the problem is we set out to be strong defensively, and if you then try and move forward too quickly, you leave room at the back. I think if we had a player that could win those long balls and hold it up, we might be okay. Funny enough, Doyle is probably the best we have as far as actually doing that goes. Which isn't saying much.
If we are going to maintain the same kind of pretty effective defence as we had on Friday, and also be able to move forward quickly, then we'd need total ball control like Spain. I don't know if there are any teams in the world right now that can attack quickly without leaving spaces at the back. Maybe Bayern or Germany? It seems a more German kind of approach, anyway.

 

[washingcattle]

The issue with Long is that he is a great nuisance player, but he is not really a ball-winner in the air, he is most definitely no Niall Quinn. So every time we lump a ball forward, it is still just going to come straight back. We need someone with height if we are going to try and play that game. Stick Richard Dunne up front when he gets back. If he gets back.
We definitely need to go 5 across midfield, I don't think anyone will argue with that, or would have argued with it for the last couple of years. 4-4-2 is dead. But I don't exactly think we were slow moving forward, the problem is we set out to be strong defensively, and if you then try and move forward too quickly, you leave room at the back. I think if we had a player that could win those long balls and hold it up, we might be okay. Funny enough, Doyle is probably the best we have as far as actually doing that goes. Which isn't saying much.
If we are going to maintain the same kind of pretty effective defence as we had on Friday, and also be able to move forward quickly, then we'd need total ball control like Spain. I don't know if there are any teams in the world right now that can attack quickly without leaving spaces at the back. Maybe Bayern or Germany? It seems a more German kind of approach, anyway.

That's Traps problem though, it's always control over ambition. We don't press players to win the ball back. We retreat into a defensive shell, allow them to have the ball for long periods wait patiently to win it back and then crawl forward with one eye on our defensive shape for the inevitable retreat as soon as we lose it.

It's how italy played 20 years ago. But they had world class players like Berti, Di Napoli, Ancelotti, Donadonni, and they had Baggio up front. They could play at a snails pace and still walk it into the opposition net at will. With the players we had 5 years ago Trap could do nothing better than be competative and hope for a break. That's what he did he got us organised and fair play to him every squad he's picked has gotten gradually better. This new post Euros squad without Duff, Given, Dunne, St Leger, Hunt, McGeady, Andrews etc was shite, but has improved. But it's now at a stage where it's not going to get any better. He's happy now that we're competitive but we should be at least trying to win rather than trying to not lose.

With the game having changed utterly by Spain or Uruguay (Even Italy have finally abandoned the retreat mentality) and with the young lads coming through now, they deserve a shot at playing modern football, except for Glenn Whelan everyone else is playing it at club level as it is.

If you commit forward there are gaps of course but goals win games, it's that simple.


I know of what I speak here because I've watched David Moyes do it all fucking season. Nearly every match we've lost was in the last 10 minutes because we drop further and further backwards and hold a "shape" instead of going out and getting hold of the ball. It's ridiculous. You can say what you like about Mourinho at Chelsea they rarely had less than 50% possesion even if they were "hanging on" to a 1-0 scoreline.

We don't show any ambition on the ball and because of that we can't hold onto it for more than a few passes because we don't have any idea of where to go with it and all the Niall Quinns in the world won't change that. No one in midfield sets the tempo, we have it dictated to us. If anyone wants to play at any sort of pace like Germany or Spain or Croatia or even fucking Kazakstan did, were fucked. Sweden never tested us because they played right into our hands.

From what I saw Austria will probably do the same actually. I still see them winning but I'm probably only saying that now so I can eat shit when we win. We're still dreadful just a more professional looking dreadful.

 

[Richie]

That's Traps problem though, it's always control over ambition. We don't press players to win the ball back. We retreat into a defensive shell, allow them to have the ball for long periods wait patiently to win it back and then crawl forward with one eye on our defensive shape for the inevitable retreat as soon as we lose it.

I actually felt like one of the positive aspects of the Sweden game was that the Irish players did press quickly to win the ball back, and high up the pitch too, even Keane in his deeper position was snapping at the heels of Elm and Kallstrom as soon as they got near the ball. Maybe Trap realises now that minus Dunne and Given we just can't do the sitting back pressure absorbing thing for the whole match (or that it was never going to be successful against the top level of opponent anyway). There is obviously still a major conservatism there, the priority was on protecting one point and the opening salvo with the fullbacks pushing up then the final 15 minutes with Hoolahan on was the biggest perceived risk he was willing to take.

 

[washingcattle]

I actually felt like one of the positive aspects of the Sweden game was that the Irish players did press quickly to win the ball back, and high up the pitch too, even Keane in his deeper position was snapping at the heels of Elm and Kallstrom as soon as they got near the ball. Maybe Trap realises now that minus Dunne and Given we just can't do the sitting back pressure absorbing thing for the whole match (or that it was never going to be successful against the top level of opponent anyway). There is obviously still a major conservatism there, the priority was on protecting one point and the opening salvo with the fullbacks pushing up then the final 15 minutes with Hoolahan on was the biggest perceived risk he was willing to take.

We started better alright, but as it went on we go more and more cautious in a match that A. We had to win and B. We should have won. You can say it's away from home 0-0 is a good result but I think if Mick or Jack had been in charge of that team and seen how bad Sweden were playing they would have forced the issue. I still don't think they're a bad team but they were shite on the night. By any reasonable set of international football standards they were fucking hopeless. We were good by our current standards and okayish by the same standards as I'm judging them. That game was there to be won. One moment of class by either side would have done it but neither of the sides had that class. One moment of sheer luck could have done it too but we never had enough ambition to force that kind of luck. We didn't manage a single shot on target.

Trap accidentally got the team's shape right for about 10 minutes before he hauled off Long (who to be fair didn't have a great game, worked hard though) and stuck on Sammon who did nothing. If the biggest risk he's willing to take is to take off Robbie Keane - a striker and put on Wes Hoolahan- a midfielder then that says it all.

 

[washingcattle]

Just watching the post match analysis on RTE now.

Fucking love the lads.

Stuck watching streams online and can't get the lads enough. The best i can get over here is Gary fucking Neville.


Anyway if you haven't seen it here's the lads having a barney again.


http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/813/378012/

Trap comes on at about 20 minutes. Actually made a fair bit of sense for once. So he's playing Green because he can run ? Well then Gibbo need never bother his arse again because pace is one thing the lad does not have.

It's always one or the other with the lads isn't it ? No pace - can pass. Has pace - can't pass. or no ace can't pass in the case of some. Anyway I'm going to find a quieter boozer on Tuesday so I can have a proper look at the match.

Kind of looking forward to it in a weird dreadful kind of way.