General election 2020 (1 Viewer)

moose

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Really? Who do people think are getting protected?

Some if not all of the following. Priests, politicians, cops, anyone involved in the selling of babies to people in the US, anyone who was involved or profited in the medical testing that went on without consent in the mother and baby homes. Anyone who covered up the countless cases of abuse. Given that the records are now sealed for 30 years we're not going to find out who the people being protected are.
 

GARYXKNIFEDX

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You know when kids are told if they see someone getting bullied they should speak up?

The general vibe im getting is its not cool to speak up if youre a politician.
 

hugh

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Given that the records are now sealed for 30 years we're not going to find out who the people being protected are.

This is the thing though. Is that actually the case?

My (limited) understanding is that they are being handed over to Tusla - for reasons that seem like something of a holding pattern until proper procedures are put in place to allow appropriate access while still protecting people's privacy. Of course, we can be cynical and say that's just a move designed to prevent any kind of meaningful access and any long-term accountability.

I do trust that guy Simon McGarr - though even he seems to be pointing to the Govt just generally making a shite of things as opposed to a deliberate strategy. Not that I really understood his piece either.

"To recap: The Minister described advice given by an unspecified AG on an unknown year (which may or may not be from before the coming into force of the GDPR) which said that an Irish law can prohibit an EU right, despite it limiting a different repealed law, based on a non existent restriction clause, which would anyway require a series of protections which it doesn’t have to be valid."

Sorry, what?
 

moose

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This is the thing though. Is that actually the case?

My (limited) understanding is that they are being handed over to Tusla - for reasons that seem like something of a holding pattern until proper procedures are put in place to allow appropriate access while still protecting people's privacy. Of course, we can be cynical and say that's just a move designed to prevent any kind of meaningful access and any long-term accountability.

I do trust that guy Simon McGarr - though even he seems to be pointing to the Govt just generally making a shite of things as opposed to a deliberate strategy. Not that I really understood his piece either.

"To recap: The Minister described advice given by an unspecified AG on an unknown year (which may or may not be from before the coming into force of the GDPR) which said that an Irish law can prohibit an EU right, despite it limiting a different repealed law, based on a non existent restriction clause, which would anyway require a series of protections which it doesn’t have to be valid."

Sorry, what?

According the Examiner but I'm not sure what's in the database and what's not.

"Apart from a database which is being sent to the child and family agency, Tusla, the records will be sealed for the next 30 years."

Of course O'Gorman contradicts that later in the piece.

 

IFF

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According the Examiner but I'm not sure what's in the database and what's not.

"Apart from a database which is being sent to the child and family agency, Tusla, the records will be sealed for the next 30 years."

Of course O'Gorman contradicts that later in the piece.


From the actual legislation passed

Deposit of certain records of Commission with Child and Family Agency
2. (1) Notwithstanding subsection (2) of section 43 of the Act of 2004, the Commission
shall, as soon as may be after the passing of this Act, deposit with the Agency the
database and all related records.
(2) For the avoidance of doubt, the obligation under subsection (1) to deposit the database
and all related records with the Agency is an obligation to so deposit the database and
all related records without redaction therefrom.

From definitions
“Agency” means the Child and Family Agency
 

moose

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From the actual legislation passed

Deposit of certain records of Commission with Child and Family Agency
2. (1) Notwithstanding subsection (2) of section 43 of the Act of 2004, the Commission
shall, as soon as may be after the passing of this Act, deposit with the Agency the
database and all related records.
(2) For the avoidance of doubt, the obligation under subsection (1) to deposit the database
and all related records with the Agency is an obligation to so deposit the database and
all related records without redaction therefrom.

From definitions
“Agency” means the Child and Family Agency

So if Tulsa will have the records who is sealing them for 30 years as stated by O'Gorman? Tulsa or are the archive and "database and all related records" two separate things?

“The law on the archive being sealed comes from the original 2004 Commissions of Investigation Act. When the commission on mother and baby homes was established in 2015 by the Oireachtas, it used the 2004 law as its basis and the consequence of that was the application of the 30-year archive rule. Accordingly, when the commission on mother and baby homes brings forth its final report and stands dissolved in law, its archive will be transferred to my Department and will be sealed for 30 years under the legislation,” he* added.

*O'Gorman
 

IFF

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So if Tulsa will have the records who is sealing them for 30 years as stated by O'Gorman? Tulsa or are the archive and "database and all related records" two separate things?

“The law on the archive being sealed comes from the original 2004 Commissions of Investigation Act. When the commission on mother and baby homes was established in 2015 by the Oireachtas, it used the 2004 law as its basis and the consequence of that was the application of the 30-year archive rule. Accordingly, when the commission on mother and baby homes brings forth its final report and stands dissolved in law, its archive will be transferred to my Department and will be sealed for 30 years under the legislation,” he* added.

*O'Gorman

The 30 year rule applies on the national archives (the release of which fills the newspaper with material around new years)

Reading the section 45 of the 2004 act here Commissions of Investigation Act 2004
The sending to Tusla is part to see if Tusla feels it can act on anything

The whole archive becoming fully public straightaway might be considered prejudicial if Tusla feels they could bring charges against any one

Section 45 of 2004 seems to allow legal action against people
 

magicbastarder

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i see lots of activity on twitter accusing the green party of hypocrisy on twitter, in relation to CETA, because ryan agreed to allow it on the agenda for a debate.
seems there are a little more shades of grey to this, but again, the GP are managing the message around this badly, even if they intend to push back.

 

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