Female rock/punk bands in Ireland? (1 Viewer)

I totally understand the frustration that comes from being referred to as a "girl band". Boy bands get to be punk bands, post-punk bands, rock bands, reggae bands, ska bands, or whatever type of bands, whereas bands where the people happen to be female are referred to as "girl bands".

That's it exactly!

The same goes for being labelled riot grrrl. Personally, I am a huge fan of riot grrrl, it really inspired me a lot, but so did lots of other things! It is narrow minded when (mostly male) people see a bunch of girls or women playing music and CAN'T THINK OF ANY WORD TO DESCRIBE IT EXCEPT FOR RIOT GRRRL! How about "freak folk dream pop" or whatever!
However I still love it when bands call themselves riot grrrl bands, because it is such a cool genre and you can still do a lot with it.

I was hugely inspired by the attitude of Riot Grrrl too, and although I wouldn't be mad into some of the music now, there are a few songs I still love (mostly by Bikini Kill). Rightly or wrongly, I just see it as something specific to a time and place - kind of like grunge I suppose.

With regards to your point on the biggest obstacle to woman being in bands being themselves - you then follow this up with the instances of sexism that are all too common when being a woman in a band. Snide remarks from promoters, engineers etc. So I think it can't all just fall on women ourselves to combat sexism - men also have to take responsibility for ending sexism!

Yes, of course you're right. Equality should be everyone's concern. I seem to have explained my point very badly (and perhaps it is indeed an obnoxious opinion). Basically the way I see it is that women have faced gender socialisation and sexism across the board and yet many have made huge inroads into other traditionally male occupations such as, say, medicine and engineering (and I have heard tales of sexist incidents in both areas that would make your hair stand on end). So this makes me think that that the reason for a lack of female participation in rock/punk isn't just that it is seen as a male preserve. It may just be that there aren't loads of women who want to be in bands. Or perhaps (and this was my idea) women see there being more obstacles to being in a band than, for example, being a civil engineer. I would suggest that the actual obstacles (the snide comments etc) are actually not in themselves insurmountable; it is our perception of them and our own sense of anxiety or self-doubt that makes it appear so. I am not blaming girls for lacking confidence, I am just saying that the issue exists. I therefore think that increasing girls' feelings of competence and mastery over the technical side of things would have a positive effect on their confidence (exactly as you're proposing to do with Girls Rock Camp) and might therefore possibly increase the number of women in bands. Does that make sense?

We are having our first meeting in Exchange Dublin on Thursday October 25th from 7pm to 10pm and I would really love if you would think about coming along. We really need voices from women who are and who have been active in the music scene. Either way, it would be totally cool if you would drop a line to [email protected].

I would love to be there - just not sure yet if I can make it due to distance :)
 
Hi Juno!
Yeah, I agree with riot grrrl being of it's time and place. One big difference for example is that lots of musicians, both female and other, have access to computers now, and make a lot of DIY music with such. And the internet has largely replaced zines, in my opinion...though I do love all sorts of zines, and there *are* lots of cool ones today. But there is also the internet...if I had to choose between a zine workshop and a website-building workshop at the camp, I would probably choose the website one. But maybe that's just me. It still surprises me how much of a radical
proposition riot grrrl STILL seems though!

That is so cool you would like to be there! Do you mind me asking where you are based? It sucks a little bit that things often end up being in Dublin by default (it just went that way as the people that responded to the initial call are mostly living in Dublin) but that doesn't mean it always has to be that way. Also, I am thinking of dedicating a small section of the meeting to messages from women* who can't make it, but who might like to support the idea in some way in the future. Would you be interested in passing on a message? If so, drop me a line at girlsrockcampireland at gmail dot com.
 
Snide remarks from promoters, engineers etc.

While I agree with pretty much everything you said. I feel that is vital to point out that if you are waiting for a day when engineers become sound, you are going to be waiting a long long long time.

Female male or beast they make snide remarks to everyone. I think it's the quality of the snide remark that actually gets them their next job.

On the other hand DIY promoters are usually unbelievably sound people by and large.
 
While I agree with pretty much everything you said. I feel that is vital to point out that if you are waiting for a day when engineers become sound, you are going to be waiting a long long long time.

Female male or beast they make snide remarks to everyone. I think it's the quality of the snide remark that actually gets them their next job.

On the other hand DIY promoters are usually unbelievably sound people by and large.

While I agree with pretty much everything you said. I feel that is vital to point out that if you are waiting for a day when engineers become sound, you are going to be waiting a long long long time.

Female male or beast they make snide remarks to everyone. I think it's the quality of the snide remark that actually gets them their next job.

On the other hand DIY promoters are usually unbelievably sound people by and large.

Hi washingcattle,
Thanks for your support!
Actually, that was Juno I was quoting.
True about sound engineers, though I have met some very sound sound engineers...but when a woman is saying that she has experienced sexism from engineers, it is best to just take that at face value. I am assuming you are a man and are in the lucky position of not having negatively experienced sexism. http://finallyfeminism101.wordpress.com/2007/03/11/faq-what-is-male-privilege/

Are you a DIY promoter? Maybe you would like to run a fundraiser for us? :p
DIY promotion is sometimes just as sexist and *ist as other scenes, maybe not deliberately. I am loathe to criticise people who are probably doing this for love rather than money, but a glance at the artist pages of some underground Irish labels will show a massive underrepresentation of women (not to mention other discriminated groups).
http://www.richtercollective.com/pages/artists
http://www.outonalimbrecords.com/
http://www.delphilabel.com/the-artists

Is it up to the labels alone to solve this problem? After all, this is just one of many things that contribute to the idea that playing in a band is "normal" when you are white, heterosexual, male. Maybe not, but acknowledging that sexism (also unintentional) also occurs on a DIY level would be a good start.
 
So should promoters put on shit bands because they have female members and labels sign bands so they're representation of women increases or should bands be judged on their musical merit regardless of member make up?

And seeing as you feel it cool to start dissing other people's efforts what have you actually done to increase the amount of women playing in bands?
 
So should promoters put on shit bands because they have female members and labels sign bands so they're representation of women increases or should bands be judged on their musical merit regardless of member make up?

That's exactly the question she is asking surely ....

And seeing as you feel it cool to start dissing other people's efforts what have you actually done to increase the amount of women playing in bands?

I don't see it as dissing people's efforts, it's really just pointing something out i.e. underground/DIY scenes seem to be just as dominated by men as any others. And in answer, to the latter part of your question ..... GirlsRockCamp, right? :)
 
That's exactly the question she is asking surely ....

I took that question as rhetorical suggesting that DIY labels and promoters are part of the problem and I'm wondering should they/we put on bands with female members for the sake of gender balance regardless of musical merit.

Also as far as I know Girlsrockcamp is just an idea being discussed as opposed to something that's actually happening and it remains to be seen whether it will lead to better representation of women in rock in Ireland. Still think it's a cool idea nonetheless just not so keen on the implied (to me at least) suggestion noted above.
 
So should promoters put on shit bands because they have female members

ah now, its not fair to say a band is shit just because they have female members.

oz_wind_up_crew_l.jpg
 
Back in 'Merica I was in 4 different bands with female singers over the years. Some were great because of the singer, some where terrible because of the singer. The only problems we had getting gigs was when we were shit.
 
Hi washingcattle,
Thanks for your support!
Actually, that was Juno I was quoting.
True about sound engineers, though I have met some very sound sound engineers...but when a woman is saying that she has experienced sexism from engineers, it is best to just take that at face value. I am assuming you are a man and are in the lucky position of not having negatively experienced sexism. http://finallyfeminism101.wordpress.com/2007/03/11/faq-what-is-male-privilege/

Are you a DIY promoter? Maybe you would like to run a fundraiser for us? :p
DIY promotion is sometimes just as sexist and *ist as other scenes, maybe not deliberately. I am loathe to criticise people who are probably doing this for love rather than money, but a glance at the artist pages of some underground Irish labels will show a massive underrepresentation of women (not to mention other discriminated groups).
http://www.richtercollective.com/pages/artists
http://www.outonalimbrecords.com/
http://www.delphilabel.com/the-artists

Is it up to the labels alone to solve this problem? After all, this is just one of many things that contribute to the idea that playing in a band is "normal" when you are white, heterosexual, male. Maybe not, but acknowledging that sexism (also unintentional) also occurs on a DIY level would be a good start.

I have done some work as a sound engineer, and I love the generalisation you have made about sound engineers.
Let's change it to this instead sure, see what happens:

"True about women, though I have met some very sound women"
 
Well just to stick up for my own label, Out on Limb have Carol Anne MacGowan (both on her own and with Hidden Highways I think), Hooray for Humans had Aine and Jen. Owensie has several girls in his band. I really wish any one of those ladies posted here so you could hear their experience of working with the lads. And that's from a tiny label with traditionally very Maths-rock/post-hardcore leanings, the least fem-friendly of all genres. I also see you've conveniently omitted Flaming June who have been pinching a lot of the top talent of late:
http://www.flamingjunerecords.com/artists/
 
Also it should be noted that Popical Island have a lot of girls. In fact, many of the boys involved are actually girls too,
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Activity
So far there's no one here
Old Thread: Hello . There have been no replies in this thread for 365 days.
Content in this thread may no longer be relevant.
Perhaps it would be better to start a new thread instead.

21 Day Calendar

Lau (Unplugged)
The Sugar Club
8 Leeson Street Lower, Saint Kevin's, Dublin 2, D02 ET97, Ireland

Support thumped.com

Support thumped.com and upgrade your account

Upgrade your account now to disable all ads...

Upgrade now

Latest threads

Latest Activity

Loading…
Back
Top