Climate change global warming natural disaster freak weather etc. (1 Viewer)

ann post

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Actually nothing. No doubt they have the absolute latest tech, its also hugely untested, unreliable and they spend millions hiding the accidents that happen

They sell a million of those things a year and pipe real time data back home.
Compared to Johnny Startup who's got one mockup in a lab that's a LOT of testing. Accidents are testing. How many wind turbine startups have 1 million data gathering units in the field in comparison.

My point is victorious lilli.
 

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They sell a million of those things a year and pipe real time data back home.
Compared to Johnny Startup who's got one mockup in a lab that's a LOT of testing. Accidents are testing. How many wind turbine startups have 1 million data gathering units in the field in comparison.

My point is victorious lilli.
My point is that you don't allow privately run businesses who only exist to hoover up government loans to run boutique turbines that will only ever be available for the richest 5%, you actually do it in a way where it scales for all.

Your point about Tesla cars will be proven over the coming years I'm quite sure.
 

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ann post

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The country's biggest ever home insulation scheme is set to be unveiled tomorrow.

Energy Minister Eamon Ryan is set to announce grants of up to €25,000 to 'deep retrofit' houses, covering between 45% and 51% of the cost of bringing older homes up to a B2 energy rating.

There will also be low-cost-loans on offer and a network of 'one-stop shops' across the country to simplify the process.
Green Party Senator Pauline O'Reilly says it will make a huge difference to the cost of household energy bills.

Bloody greens.
 

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Bloody greens.
It's not the Greens fault per se but if the government cared then endless, convoluted applications for a means-tested grant and a "low-cost loan" (how low cost btw?) would be replaced with a program to retrofit the entire country paid for by taxes covering close to 100% of the housing stock where no one makes a profit but it gets done.

You and I have been through this before, the Greens are completely irrelevant and always will be, they're just a yardstick for the actual people in charge to decide how much of their budget to allocate to "green" projects.
 

ann post

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It's not the Greens fault per se but if the government cared then endless, convoluted applications for a means-tested grant and a "low-cost loan" (how low cost btw?) would be replaced with a program to retrofit the entire country paid for by taxes covering close to 100% of the housing stock where no one makes a profit but it gets done.

You and I have been through this before, the Greens are completely irrelevant and always will be, they're just a yardstick for the actual people in charge to decide how much of their budget to allocate to "green" projects.

I dont think them being not in govt in this instance would have had the same result. Maybe you do?
 

ann post

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I do. I don't hate them or anything, it's likely my transferred vote went to a Green who I think is a good local TD.

I kinda think that's a bit of a stretch tbh. Very simply, no other party had any environmental policy, now FG and getting thier inaction on Paris agreement dragged in europe. I don't see how a bunch of thatchers and a bunch of post-publican neo liberals would have bothered at all. Are you really willing to make that bet on FFG?
 

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I kinda think that's a bit of a stretch tbh. Very simply, no other party had any environmental policy, now FG and getting thier inaction on Paris agreement dragged in europe. I don't see how a bunch of thatchers and a bunch of post-publican neo liberals would have bothered at all. Are you really willing to make that bet on FFG?
I think any party in February 2020 lived in February 2020 with climate marches and the like, and in 2022 it hasn't gone away and, besides, even Thatcherites are willing to pretend to be green for good press



So yeah, I think if you magicked away the Green Party we'd be in the same situation with the same policies, maybe slightly tweaked one way or other, sure why not. The Green Party have demonstrated time and time again that they cannot win an election, and in their "we'll work with anyone" policy they have also shown that they are a pushover who will do as they are told.

I will not hold the Greens responsible for the shit I hate that FF/FG implement, but I will also not give them credit for the stuff that comes through that looks vaguely good. It's not their government, it's not their policies, and if they disappeared tomorrow there'd still be FF/FG TDs under pressure from 8% or whatever of the electorate to do more "green" stuff.
 

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You seem to be saying that the policies that get implemented are what The People Of Ireland want, and who's in govt is kinda irrelevant. Governments aren't the problem, the citizens are

... which I kinda agree with
The "People of Ireland" vs. 62.9% voter turnout.

I suppose it's actually not too bad a number after 40 years of being told by television, movies and increasingly the government themselves that the government is the real problem, your vote means nothing because all governments are corrupt and everything should be privatized and run like a business.... but it's still 4 out of every 10 registered voters not voting.

If the Greens had refused to go into government with FF/FG on some kind of principle would they have managed to broker a coalition? Maybe we'd have had to have a second election where Sinn Fein ran a lot more people.
 

ann post

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If the Greens had refused to go into government with FF/FG on some kind of principle would they have managed to broker a coalition? Maybe we'd have had to have a second election where Sinn Fein ran a lot more people.
No, because PBP backed out not leaving enough numbers for a coalition in that instance.

I don't really have time to get into it but what we are evaluating here is

What the greens have managed with 13% of govt

vs.

your fantasy of what would have happened if it went as you imagined it.

I'm evaluating on the fly based on real time events rather than evaluating based on 'well this happened 20 years ago'.

The twenty years ago was bad. the present is far and above the most they've ever done.

and the point about going into govt with anyone - i think that's moot in terms of what a green party is for. It's actually better having them in with the neolibs in that sense.
 

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