Celebrity Creeps Thread (2 Viewers)

[therealjohnny]

Nice work, by the way. Despite...well....

 

[Anthony]

A lot of it is garbage. I'll update it someday.

 

[flashback]

This might be a stupid question.

Is being rapey similar to being a pedo in the sense that you don't just wake up one day and become a pedo for a few hours, it's a longer lasting part of your sexuality. That is, people who are pedophiles seem to stay that way for years (indefinitely?).

Would it be fair to say that about rape too? Like if a fella is into that kind of thing, wouldn't partners or even possibly friends, notice?

You can see in some cases when a single rape allegation arises, a cascade of them follow; suggesting this is a recurring theme over multiple people over a period of time. But the barrier of entry for an actual rape allegation is quite high, even if others have gone before you.

So, if you had an instance of a person getting accused of rape and there's no evidence other than one person's word against the other, would it be ethical or useful to talk to previous partners and see if that seems shocking to them, or part of a pattern?

 

[magicbastarder]

i recall hearing someone being interviewed by ryan tubridy (not someone i listen to often) who IIRC worked kinda on the intersection between the psychology and the law in relation to child sex abusers; he commented that in his career, most child sex abuser he'd dealt with had themselves been abused. he was very quick to point out that this was *not* a reason to automatically suspect someone who'd been abused, of being a potential abuser.
but anyway, if his point was true, child sex abuse could have a 'genesis' separate from what leads someone to commit rape? in that most rapists (i assume) were never themselves raped?

 

[dudley]

Isn't rape about power though, not sex? So, it's not a part of the offenders sexuality as such?

Myth: Rape is about sex. People who rape do it because they cannot control their sexual desire.
Reality: Rape is not about sex. Rape is about having power and control over another person. Three out of five rapists are also in consenting sexual relationships. This myth takes the blame off of the rapist and does not hold him accountable for his actions.

 

[flashback]

i recall hearing someone being interviewed by ryan tubridy (not someone i listen to often) who IIRC worked kinda on the intersection between the psychology and the law in relation to child sex abusers; he commented that in his career, most child sex abuser he'd dealt with had themselves been abused. he was very quick to point out that this was *not* a reason to automatically suspect someone who'd been abused, of being a potential abuser.
but anyway, if his point was true, child sex abuse could have a 'genesis' separate from what leads someone to commit rape? in that most rapists (i assume) were never themselves raped?

maybe I shouldn't have said people don't just become* pedophiles, I've heard this idea that it's a result of being abused yourself. The point i was trying to make was it doesn't seem to be a transient thing, it's a pattern of behaviour that lasts for a period of time.

And I guess I was wondering is rape a similar sort of deal, is there typically a history of abusive or violent behaviour that goes along with it. And if there was, could that history be looked at.

*edit, I've also heard it alleged that being an active abuser requires a blend of two traits. It requires the desire to have sex with children, but it also requires the ability to either not care that you're damaging a person or alternatively the ability to convince yourself that the child enjoys the rape. The person making this statement then suggested that having both of these traits is quite a lot rarer than just one. Ie there's an awful lot of people who find children sexually attractive, but don't act upon it because they understand it's not acceptable.

That one stuck with me.

 

[egg_]

Isn't rape about power though, not sex? So, it's not a part of the offenders sexuality as such?

I've always found this very hard to believe.

 

[Cornu Ammonis]

I don’t think you can easily or cleanly split any of these behaviours up like that. No more than you can say that other behaviours (sexual or otherwise) are due to one thing.

 

[magicbastarder]

I've always found this very hard to believe.

i have read* that the claim grew from 60s or 70s feminist ideology, and was never supported by research.

* steven pinker's 'the blank slate', so probably about 20 years ago.

 

[Unicron]

i have read* that the claim grew from 60s or 70s feminist ideology, and was never supported by research.

* steven pinker's 'the blank slate', so probably about 20 years ago.

There does have to be some reason why men who might have the sex available to them, be it through just finding a willing partner or through the purchase of it, would take the option of rape though yeah?

When people say rape is about power they might not mean that it's about a specific rapist exerting power of their specific victim but also it's about the societal power structures that give men who rape a sense of entitlement to take sex from unwilling women.

 

[Lili Marlene]

It's a soundbyte that really sounds divorced from whatever the original context was.

I like to think that if people's brains are as infinitely malleable as some argue then even the worst person could be reformed in some way but that's probably wishful thinking. The alternative imho is just another step on the forever road to death camps though. Never underestimate the ability of society to choose you as their next target.

 

[Unicron]

It's a soundbyte that really sounds divorced from whatever the original context was.

I like to think that if people's brains are as infinitely malleable as some argue then even the worst person could be reformed in some way but that's probably wishful thinking. The alternative imho is just another step on the forever road to death camps though. Never underestimate the ability of society to choose you as their next target.

Years ago I was talking to a friend's housemate, they were both doing psychology PhD's (that's the sort of big brain company I used to keep) and the housemate was telling me about what he was doing. His field was working with sex offenders in prison, trying to assess their likelihood of reoffending and seeing if things can be done to mitigate the likelihood,

They're an hugely unsympathetic category of person but if society isn't at a "lock them up forever" point then something should be done to see if reoffending is can be made less likely. The housemate said to me that in some (but not all and he didn't offer a percentage split) cases in his opinion the primary motivation for offending wasn't sexual but rather the crimes were an ultimate expression of self destructive tendencies caused by various other factors and if you deal with those then with that subgroup of offender if the other factors are addressed he thought reoffending could be less likely.

This, obviously, isn't to frame someone who perpetrates a sex offence as a victim, the victim was their victim.

 

[David Kronenbourg]

Arcade Fire’s Win Butler Accused of Sexual Misconduct by Multiple Women; Frontman Responds

Allegations of inappropriate behavior in his life offstage contrast with Butler’s virtuous public reputation. In lengthy comments, the frontman claims his extramarital relationships were consensual.

pitchfork.com

 

[Deadmanposting]

Arcade Fire’s Win Butler Accused of Sexual Misconduct by Multiple Women; Frontman Responds

Allegations of inappropriate behavior in his life offstage contrast with Butler’s virtuous public reputation. In lengthy comments, the frontman claims his extramarital relationships were consensual.

pitchfork.com

He looks bad on two levels here.
He's pushing himself on these young women, when there is no clear green light it seems.
And he's a goddamn rock star that doesn't know how to get laid. I mean, Jesus. You play to 90 people in Whelan's and you could go home with someone. Dope.

Also, he's married and had to drag the wife into this to fight his corner. Can you imagine the absolute death of those conversations?
Three levels.


Pitchfork timed this for the week their tour starts.
Haha. Right in the fucking goolies.

 

[Lili Marlene]

Jesus Christ, Pitchfork dissecting instagram messages, it's like a modern episode of Dawson's Creek. You get the sexual controversies, and the press, your music deserves I guess.

 

[Deadmanposting]

Jesus Christ, Pitchfork dissecting instagram messages, it's like a modern episode of Dawson's Creek. You get the sexual controversies, and the press, your music deserves I guess.

It also seems like he had to plead his case at the Court of Pitchfork
Like they were taking statements and corroborating witness statements

They assign a score to it all; anything over 8.0 and you're officially Pitchfork guilty





Puts Brendan O'Connor in a pickle with his intro music and all

 

[dudley]

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[Cornu Ammonis]

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Well, that’s unpleasant.

 

[therealjohnny]

He posted something similar 5 years ago. That poor family.

 

[JohnnyRaz]

There does have to be some reason why men who might have the sex available to them, be it through just finding a willing partner or through the purchase of it, would take the option of rape though yeah?

When people say rape is about power they might not mean that it's about a specific rapist exerting power of their specific victim but also it's about the societal power structures that give men who rape a sense of entitlement to take sex from unwilling women.

Related unrelated - I read an article recently re gang rape in war - essentially the premise was that unlike rape in ‘normal’ circumstances that the people who engage in it are to all extents psychologically ‘normal’ - and that it’s pretty much driven by group dynamics (my summarising). More likely to happen when morale is low and discipline is lax