BREXIT (3 Viewers)

flashback

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this is... unconvincing
pretty sure I covered all the groups my dude.

The idiots. The not idiots. And the line in between them.

Just noticed @Lili Marlene 's thing about noblesse oblige among the upper classes. That was a huge thing. I was reading about that before, there was this conscious effort where the upper classes would try to live life as a good example and inspiration to the lower classes.

I suppose it's a bit like celebrity culture now. But yeah, being upper class had this onus of responsibility that they had to learn about, act, and explain, how to behave properly to the lower classes. It's interesting, lots of them took it very seriously and earnestly. You can just about see it if you listen to/read Bertrand Russell interviews. You can kind of still see remnants of it with the Royals today, they do believe they are an example to be followed. Well, possibly not that rapey lad. But on the whole I suppose.
 

Unicron

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I suppose it's a bit like celebrity culture now. But yeah, being upper class had this onus of responsibility that they had to learn about, act, and explain, how to behave properly to the lower classes. It's interesting, lots of them took it very seriously and earnestly. You can just about see it if you listen to/read Bertrand Russell interviews. You can kind of still see remnants of it with the Royals today, they do believe they are an example to be followed. Well, possibly not that rapey lad. But on the whole I suppose.

The last audiobook I listened to was Pride and Prejudice and Mr. Darcy is very uptight and weird. That idea sheds a bit of light on why he is like that.
 

flashback

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The last audiobook I listened to was Pride and Prejudice and Mr. Darcy is very uptight and weird. That idea sheds a bit of light on why he is like that.
yeah, it's one of those things that's really obvious once you see it.
You can kind of retroactively apply it to loads of stuff and go "ahhhh, right". White Man's burden sort of thing.

I like to imagine all these little minor nobles waking up in Eton (Eton's a boarding school right?), and suddenly realizing the crushing weight of having to teach poor people that eating each other is considered a social faux pas.
 

seanc

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yeah, it's one of those things that's really obvious once you see it.
You can kind of retroactively apply it to loads of stuff and go "ahhhh, right". White Man's burden sort of thing.

I like to imagine all these little minor nobles waking up in Eton (Eton's a boarding school right?), and suddenly realizing the crushing weight of having to teach poor people that eating each other is considered a social faux pas.
Ah bless 'em.
I get raised eyebrows when I say to other Irish people "well at least Harry and Will can fly helicopters. That's actually a skill that most people can't do." Y'know, compared to Andrew and the rest of royalty in Europe, fairplay. They definitely do fall an extreme version of the White Mans Burden.
The Brexiteers though tend to just rely on rabble rousing shite. I don't think the british royals were pro-brexit, as brexit makes it harder for them to marry their cousins. It's more the jingoistic idiots who love the royals. Because like that's English and that innit mate an you don't know nuffink about wha youre talking about and something about immigrants and that. My dads Oirish as it goes.

Eton is a boarding school. I'm sure they must have dayboys though.


/waffle. I basically agree with Lili Marlene.
 

Lili Marlene

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Lol that the UK is facing down an actual winter of discontent with no power and empty shelves and no way of fixing it and the only way you know this is the case because the papers are saying nothing about it.
 

seanc

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Lol that the UK is facing down an actual winter of discontent with no power and empty shelves and no way of fixing it and the only way you know this is the case because the papers are saying nothing about it.
Honestly, not from what I've seen.
Except for the fuel thing. But that seems to be getting sorted out.
The papers are saying nothing about it because A) Irish people aren't bothered, and B) people who drive don't read papers, because they're driving. I'm sure if I dared to listen to talk radio I'd hear all about it.

This is quite a wide-ranging conversation and I've lost my focus. Sorry, bring me back pls thx.
 

Lili Marlene

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The papers are saying nothing because they did their job by getting rid of Corbyn, it's now Starmer's job to lose, lose, lose while wearing a suit like a fucking gombeen Irish politician and he's doing swimmingly.

But here, RTE just sent me a notification to let me know that Eamon Ryan has announced that Ireland will hopefully not have to have blackouts ourselves so I look forward to our blackouts.

Fucking hell, capitalism is there to destroy the planet and everything on it, yes, but we were supposed to have treats until that happened, we're not even getting our treats now! I need to go read some NYTimes pieces on Venezuala to cheer myself up.
 

Cormcolash

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Just noticed @Lili Marlene 's thing about noblesse oblige among the upper classes. That was a huge thing. I was reading about that before, there was this conscious effort where the upper classes would try to live life as a good example and inspiration to the lower classes.
The Venetian Republic was practically built on this kind of thinking, but it goes right back to the Romans really
 

ann post

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Surely that was competition for status among the upper classes rather than anything to do with concern for the plebs? It'd be a mistake to think the upper classes of the past were sounder than they are now

Being really quite pleasant and polite company while building stunning palaces on offshore slavery kinda buzz. Not too far from the modern (Us included)
 

magicbastarder

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possibly someone just jockeying for cultural superiority, but i was talking to a frenchwoman once who claimed that the french had no time for all those rules and regulations surrounding food that the british have; that it's more about ritual and showing your knowledge of arcane rules for the british, and more about the food for the french (the discussion was set off by a comment that you shouldn't lick your knife, and her attitude was 'what in holy hell is wrong with licking food off the items you're meant to eat it off?!!')
 

Cormcolash

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Surely that was competition for status among the upper classes rather than anything to do with concern for the plebs? It'd be a mistake to think the upper classes of the past were sounder than they are now
It was a bit of a mixture of both. The Venetian Republic had at least 3 levels (if not more) of organisation (councils) involved in stuff like elections and city organisation. The 'lowest' level council had thousands of 'voters' on it, so keeping them happy would have meant keeping the city in general happy as much as possible. The middle council would have had probably 60–100 'voters', then the top table would be like 12 of them (and even then the Doge's 'inner council' was just 4-6). For the middle ages, Venice was quite enlightened governmentally; their system was probably based on the Roman Republic I guess, the city was founded by what were essentially Roman refugees escaping from the likes of the Huns. Hun bastards.
 

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