fucking nuns (1 Viewer)

also, the constitution states that the state shall not endow any religion.
does giving a religious order a €300m+ (emphasis on the plus there, i guess) hospital sneak under on a technicality?
And how is it the taxpayer is funding the build when the nuns still owe the state €3m??
This fucking country.
 
did you see where rhona mahony is peter boylan's sister-in-law?

bit awkward
Didn't know that. I've changed my opinion on her too, she was a right bint on Morning Ireland the other day. Suits her of course to retain Mastership of the new hospital. It's all politics and depressingly familiar.
 
It's astonishing that people have to keep articulating their concerns over a Catholic influence on a maternity hospital. Currently listening to yet another expert on RTE radio having to go through it all point by point again.
Interviewer: "now now, the fox has guaranteed that although he will own the hen house but will not interfere in any way, why won't you accept this?"
 
It's astonishing that people have to keep articulating their concerns over a Catholic influence on a maternity hospital. Currently listening to yet another expert on RTE radio having to go through it all point by point again.
Interviewer: "now now, the fox has guaranteed that although he will own the hen house but will not interfere in any way, why won't you accept this?"
Tone fucking deaf
 
It seems to me that it's less about vested interests etc. than it is about

1. FG paternalism - "this is all very complicated, if you understood the complexities you'd see this is the only way,"
2. FG conservatism - "it's been done like this always for lots of reasons, there's no reason to change"

The "giving the nuns millions" is a bit of red herring, the hospital will be in public use either way, who's balance sheet it lives on it a bit irrelevant to the work that's done there.

Who ultimately has a say over the work that is done there - that is the issue.

There's going to be a shitload of these issues over the coming years as the state disentangles itself from the church.

I hope they won't be as tone deaf in future.
 
It seems to me that it's less about vested interests etc. than it is about

1. FG paternalism - "this is all very complicated, if you understood the complexities you'd see this is the only way,"
2. FG conservatism - "it's been done like this always for lots of reasons, there's no reason to change"

The "giving the nuns millions" is a bit of red herring, the hospital will be in public use either way, who's balance sheet it lives on it a bit irrelevant to the work that's done there.

Who ultimately has a say over the work that is done there - that is the issue.

There's going to be a shitload of these issues over the coming years as the state disentangles itself from the church.

I hope they won't be as tone deaf in future.

I'm no accountant, but doesn't ownership confer certain rights around being able to leverage it as an asset to use as collateral?
 
Minister urges broad discussion on ownership in health service
Mr Harris briefed his Government colleagues on the row over the new maternity hospital yesterday, where he received strong support from colleagues to push ahead with the project.
A Government spokesman said the process involving the two hospitals and the Department of Health to give legal effect to the agreement between the hospitals could take place “in a less shrill atmosphere”.
Political sources say the Government is anxious to see the controversy defused before TDs returns from their Easter break next week, when the issue is sure to be raised on the floor of the Dáil.
idiots

'let's defuse the controversy by ignoring the issues, antagonising the public, and trying to steamroller through'

'great idea boss, sure it worked with Irish Water'
 
getting closer to figuring out what the real issue is

John McManus: Maternity hospital row has as much to do with money as God

from the comments:
'The fact that a private organisation is being gifted a hospital speaks volumes about the way the health service in this country continues to be stealthily privatised. One in four hospital beds in our health system is private and the best cancer-treatment facilities in the country are all in private clinics (private hospitals are not 'hospitals' as such). The NMH is being handed to a health company - that is basically what the SOC are. They couldn't possibly be described as a religious congregation in any real sense as most of their 200-odd members are currently beyond retirement age and all of them will be so in a decade. That they are an organisation with religious affiliation is of course the reality and adds insult to injury, but if St. Vincent's Hospital was owned by a commercial company with absolutely no religious affiliation, you can bet that the same deal between the state and that company would have ensued. In Ireland, private interest always comes before the national interest. Just look at Coveney's comical plans to build social and affordable housing - it's all about private-sector investment and private-sector-led development. We shouldn't be surprised at the NMH deal with the SOC, but we must not let it go through under any circumstances.'
 
The "giving the nuns millions" is a bit of red herring, the hospital will be in public use either way, who's balance sheet it lives on it a bit irrelevant to the work that's done there.
kieran mulvey explained that the SOC cannot gift the land to the state as the land is collateral on several loans. which raises as many questions as it doesn't answer. what happens then if the SOC defaulted on that loan? will some foreign bank come in and lay claim to the land?
 
I'm no accountant, but doesn't ownership confer certain rights around being able to leverage it as an asset to use as collateral?
I'm not sure.

If you can't sell it because there's a hospital on it you don't own and there's an agreement in place that the hospital has use of the land etc. it's not going to be much good as collateral for anything.

More relevant would be whether it's already collateral for something (which I think someone mentioned it is) so this is a nice Irish, don't rock the boat, let's all be friends way of getting around that inconvenience.
 
The NMH is being handed to a health company - that is basically what the SOC are. They couldn't possibly be described as a religious congregation in any real sense as most of their 200-odd members are currently beyond retirement age and all of them will be so in a decade.

Yip. Who is doing the negotiating here, a handful of aged nuns or a business masquerading as a croup of aged nuns.
 
I'm not sure.

If you can't sell it because there's a hospital on it you don't own and there's an agreement in place that the hospital has use of the land etc. it's not going to be much good as collateral for anything.

More relevant would be whether it's already collateral for something (which I think someone mentioned it is) so this is a nice Irish, don't rock the boat, let's all be friends way of getting around that inconvenience.
The land - which was apparently originally given to the nuns by the state - is apparently collateral in some of their other deals. If they can't use the state-built hospital they're going to be handed for free as more collateral, and they're not going to be able to impose their "catholic ethos" on it, then why do they want it? Forgive me for not assuming altruistic reasons.
 
dyn004_original_396_520_pjpeg_2646967_6276b0a37300621e2cfb91327bc2b015.jpg
 
I'm still amazed that this is taking so long to sort out, or that it's even up for debate at all.

What About Article 44.2.5?

Did you hear Mattie MCGrath on Pat Kenny this morning.
Somewhere between dUnbelievables and Family Guy - I understood about 10% of what he was saying and the rest was nonsense. A steam of bogger gibberish consciousness
 
Did you hear Mattie MCGrath on Pat Kenny this morning.
Somewhere between dUnbelievables and Family Guy - I understood about 10% of what he was saying and the rest was nonsense. A steam of bogger gibberish consciousness


Unreal! Hilarious if he wasn't taken so seriously. The texts that Pat read out were more encouraging.
 

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