Climate change global warming natural disaster freak weather etc. (2 Viewers)

There is no need to act the dickhead.

What we are talking about is whether I think, whether it is my considered opinion, that the Greens make a difference in this current government, in this current year.

Your question as to what do I think this world that does not exist would look like is as much a fantasy as my answer. I do not think we live in a world where the Green Party does not exist so if you are not interested in my answer then don't ask the question.

If the Green Party won an election, or a very large share of the vote, then I think they could make important decisions in government and we could see what they were, however I believe that will never happen.
 
I will not hold the Greens responsible for the shit I hate that FF/FG implement, but I will also not give them credit for the stuff that comes through that looks vaguely good.
You refuse to give the Greens any credit for anything "green" that gets implemented by the government that they are part of? That seems kinda harsh
 
In all fairness, that's a strange reaction lili.

I pointed to something the greens are doing that might be of interest to thumped people with houses that exists and it inspired you to tell me the greens were irrelivant and you don't like entertaining the idea that they arent.
 
You refuse to give the Greens any credit for anything "green" that gets implemented by the government that they are part of? That seems kinda harsh
Yeah it's pretty harsh, I agree. I'm sure they do something, and they probably stay some stupider hands from pressing the wrong buttons here and there, but I have little faith in them and I won't be celebrating them.

In all fairness, that's a strange reaction lili.

I pointed to something the greens are doing that might be of interest to thumped people with houses that exists and it inspired you to tell me the greens were irrelivant and you don't like entertaining the idea that they arent.
It is of interest! I'm talking about because it's of interest!

I believe it's a bad, neoliberal policy that's the equivalent of putting new brake pads on the soul harvester. The problem is the soul harvester.

We'll see what the details of it are tomorrow but I don't have 25k lying around to avail of the other 25k and I don't know anyone else who does either.
 
Ok, the reason I am pissing and moaning about this is because I have been trained through 40 years of living from the early 80s through to now, to automatically assume that the government is against me, does not represent my interests, and will never help me in any way. To take it for granted that anytime the government does offer to help it'll all be a lie that is clawed back through hours of labyrinthine paperwork, means-tested everything, market-based solutions that ultimately only help the rich, and i should feel bad about this because it's my own fault for not being rich to avail of these things in the first place.

So when I see another plan to save the planet it takes me a few minutes to think about it rationally and go "oh wait, if they cared they'd just do it, like how they electrified the country. They wouldn't look to a market-based solution akin the the National Broadband Plan. They'd do it. "

and so I say that out loud on here, and then you all (quite rightly) tell me i'm just a moaner who doesn't appreciate the hard work being done by the Greens.

What I want is something better, I want more politics, not less.
 
Do you think you might be doomed to feel that any policy or political change can only ever be bad because it doesn't change everything?
I think the failures of Sanders and Corbyn put to rest any idea I had that change through a quick fix of top-down leader-led approach to politics in this world is possible, and the only way forward I see from the bottom up. In a lot of ways it was foolish to believe otherwise, but hey, the first viable candidates for something different since the day I was born, I think getting excited about it was understandable.

I don't see it as a case for depoliticalization, or despair, far from it, but maybe to not be fooled by those who claim it's possible to keep the current system in place, and for everyone to win under it.

If we believe climate change is real then political change is coming, whether we like it or not, and the variations on Thatcherism and Reaganomics - which is the economic policy that every government in Ireland, the UK, and the USA have had in common throughout my entire life - aren't going to fix it.
 
Alas, when that political change does come we might find ourselves nostalgic for our relatively pleasant lives under Thatcherism/Reaganomics :(
🎶One day you'll walk right out of this life
And then you'll wonder why you didn't try🎵

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Also, then play Walls Come Tumbling Down if we're singing some SOULcialism
 
Alas, when that political change does come we might find ourselves nostalgic for our relatively pleasant lives under Thatcherism/Reaganomics :(

I do think this is the likely outcome, i don't phrase it the same but it's not wildy different. I mostly see the present, even the slightly shitty present with the pandemic and all as dream like era. we* are all living like the oligarchs used to live. We* were some extent born into it. It should kinda never have happened, but it did.

*western europe, canada, america, middle class emergent china, the rich middle east, a few others
 
I think maybe we should stop beating ourselves up for our supposedly fantastic lives just because it could always be worse, and realize that this is what the actual oligarchs of today want us to do because otherwise we'd be outraged at their very existence where they are buying yachts for their yachts.

So yeah, when I see the house prices vs wages from 1979 compared to now, i'm not too worried about the risk of things getting worse if, god forbid, the anarchist left on thumped have to lose their (apparently?) precious Thatcherism.

 
I think maybe we should stop beating ourselves up for our supposedly fantastic lives just because it could always be worse, and realize that this is what the actual oligarchs of today want us to do because otherwise we'd be outraged at their very existence where they are buying yachts for their yachts.

So yeah, when I see the house prices vs wages from 1979 compared to now, i'm not too worried about the risk of things getting worse if, god forbid, the anarchist left on thumped have to lose their (apparently?) precious Thatcherism.


I was hoping for pics of the yacht yacht. Do ya reckon he listens to yacht rock on his yacht yacht?
 
I was hoping for pics of the yacht yacht. Do ya reckon he listens to yacht rock on his yacht yacht?
Double yacht rock, what's that? Some modern retro stuff? War on Drugs maybe?


Anyway, this is happening today with his yacht


As of Thursday, more than 600 Facebook users said they would attend an event, titled “Throwing eggs at superyacht Jeff Bezos,” where they plan to gather by the bridge to throw eggs at the boat. “Rotterdammers are proud of their city and don’t tear down iconic buildings just because you are super rich,” said Pablo Strörmann, the event organizer, who said he started the Facebook group “mostly” as a joke
 
Ok, the reason I am pissing and moaning about this is because I have been trained through 40 years of living from the early 80s through to now, to automatically assume that the government is against me, does not represent my interests, and will never help me in any way. To take it for granted that anytime the government does offer to help it'll all be a lie that is clawed back through hours of labyrinthine paperwork, means-tested everything, market-based solutions that ultimately only help the rich, and i should feel bad about this because it's my own fault for not being rich to avail of these things in the first place.

So when I see another plan to save the planet it takes me a few minutes to think about it rationally and go "oh wait, if they cared they'd just do it, like how they electrified the country. They wouldn't look to a market-based solution akin the the National Broadband Plan. They'd do it. "

and so I say that out loud on here, and then you all (quite rightly) tell me i'm just a moaner who doesn't appreciate the hard work being done by the Greens.

What I want is something better, I want more politics, not less.

I saw a comment recently about how there’s a sort of fantasy among lefty types, where they all believe that the green party in their own country is bad, but that green parties in *other* countries are sort of good-ish; but it’s actually never true, green parties everywhere are professional-managerial bourgeois deckchair-rearrangers. at least Ireland isn’t in nato — the green party over here in germany is practically pissing themselves with delight at the prospect of war in ukraine
 
I saw a comment recently about how there’s a sort of fantasy among lefty types, where they all believe that the green party in their own country is bad, but that green parties in *other* countries are sort of good-ish; but it’s actually never true, green parties everywhere are professional-managerial bourgeois deckchair-rearrangers. at least Ireland isn’t in nato — the green party over here in germany is practically pissing themselves with delight at the prospect of war in ukraine
I think the issue is that any green party is pretty much a single-issue party, akin to the Brexit party, except their issue is so wooly and open to interpretation that it can encompass the entire political spectrum and survive. More of a vibes party than a political party.
 
i think i asked here before, but i am curious as to whether there is a term for an organisation whose ultimate goal should be the elimination of their need or reason to exist. if the term doesn't exist, it should.
most charities would fall into that category too, i guess.
 
over the gas disruption driving down GHG emissions? or are they just gumming for a bit of argy-bargy?

the german greens had a big internal fight in the 90s between the two main wings of the party — the “fundis” and the “realos” (so, “fundamentalist” hardcore eco-warrior people, and “realistic” managerial types). the “realos” won the day, and they went into government with the SPD, with joska fischer as foreign minister.

fischer promptly joined the NATO bombing of serbia (first deployment of german armed forces outside germany since 1945). so the “realos” not only crushed the “fundis” internally, but they also ended up being a critical *pro-war* voice in german politics, and have remained so to this day. like their symbol is a fucking flower but they were the actual people to order the bombing of belgrade, it’s pretty absurdly hypocritical.

and so, to this day, they are just weirdly hyper-pro-NATO, and with NATO basically prodding the russians into a corner over the last 20 years, they are now in a situation where putin is finally willing to possibly push back (in an asshole way! I’m not a putin fan!), and big chunks of the german greens are sort of fine with the idea of war in ukraine

but yeah, we all love windmills, right
 

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